CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[klover]

Hi all,

Wondering if there are any members with ISF certification. I was inquiring with ISF about the cost of getting trained and curious to know what experiences calibrators have had.

Specifically, is there a "market" to support and justify the $1000 training and equipment or do most people simply think tweaking the brightness is sufficient?

Thanks.

[ecrabb]

I've looked into getting certified. I even got buy-in from the wife to spend the money. I wanted to do it more for the experience than anything else (and still may at some point), but I was also thinking that if I could just make enough money to pay for the course, I'd be happy. The problem is that to do it right, you really need the equipment, which is a serious investment WELL beyond the price of the certification... and would take quite awhile to make back where I live.

From my analysis, I think it could be a good secondary money maker and a great service offering if you already sold displays and projectors, or if you were already doing design, integration and installation. It would also work if you were retired or doing it for supplemental income. But, to try to do it as a primary source of income, I think you'd have to be in a huge market.

There are people out there that are willing to pay for the service, so it's not a matter of no market. But, like all businesses, finding your potential customers and convincing them to spend their money is the hard part. The other snag is that as a lot of the shops that sell the equipment add the service, you get shut out. There's even a shop here in my little city that started doing it as a value-add - every display they sell is calibrated by an ISF tech - it's built right into the price.

SC

[Tinman]

Don't waste your money.

I own 8 different color analyzers and am not afraid to use 'em. There are loads of "ISF Certified" (Ooooooooooo........) people out there, but only a few that own a color analyzer. ISF isn't worth anything without the tools.

I calibrate Studio monitors every day. No one cares if "I" am certified, only that my calibration is correct.

Marc

[klover]

[klover]

[Tinman]

[Mad Mr H]

Totally agree.

I have seen ISF trained people that use NON ISF certified equipment.

I have ISF approved equipment but am not trained by ISF.


Im self taught , I would like to go on a course to check I am doing right but at the end of the day my equipment produces a 3 page report so this shows how good the results are..........



SPEND THE MONEY ON EXCELENT TEST EQUIPMENT - thats my opinion.

[ecrabb]

So, Mad - you're self-taught. That's great, but then you probably don't sell the service (much).

Marc, where and how did you learn the process and gain the expertise that led you to have studios paying you handsomely for the service... with no credentials no less. Now, I'm not saying an ISF certification would gain you any credibility whatsoever in a professional production environment - it wouldn't. I'm just wondering what DID give you the credibility and experience. I assume it's not something you sat down and learned over a weekend. I assume it's years of learning and experience.

Personally, I would use the certification as an intensive learning experience to learn a lot more than I know about calibration (which is very little). I wouldn't expect it to be some sort of magical life experience that would teach me everything anyone could ever want or need to know about color and calibration.

I hear people bad-mouthing ISF all the time and it kind of annoys me. Nobody is saying the ISF is the be-all end-all purveyor of all earthly calibration knowledge. In my opinion, they filled a very necessary niche. Since the ISF came along, at least most consumer electronics retailers and installers know something about calibration - which is a whole hell of a lot more than the 'nothing' they knew before.

I think for what it is, and comparing to some other professional certifications, I don't think it's bad at all. Marc, unless you'd be willing to fly to Iowa for a few days for a measly grand or $1200 or whatever I'd have to pay for the ISF certification, what other means to do I have to learn what tools are necessary and how to operate them to become competent calibrating a variety of types of displays? I'm not being snarky - I'm actually curious as to what you think the best means would be to get started doing what you do, and if the ISF isn't a good start, what is.

Thanks!

SC

[Tinman]

SC,

Simple answer.... I've been around a while, everyone knows me personally, and I REPAIR the gear first. The Cal came later as a bonus service. My customers know and trust me.

Marc

[klover]

Ok, so we established that you don't need the ISF certification. Unfortunately, I don't have the same "they know me" credentials so does anyone else here have any ISF-specific experience/advice?

Thanks!

[Tinman]

klover,

As a hobby, ISF cert is a waste of money. However, if you plan to make a business off it, have a color analyzer (a GOOD one) and need to advertise your services, then by all means do get the paper.

In my case, I don't need it. I am already established and own more equipment than most shops. For me it would be a total waste of money. For the casual calibrator it's also a waste of money.

BUT.... say you have your certification, color analyzer, a real nifty haliburton case and really cool business cards...... what will you do when you walk into a customers place only to find out you don't know that particular set? Do you need a service remote? Special tools? Does the set need a few caps replaced to bring it into spec? Or do you only plan to walk into 'NEW" installs?

I just did my plasma. Turns out you need a specially modified service remote to get into the alignment menus. The customer remote won't cut it. Some sets REQUIRE a laptop with an I2C or serial interface and diagnostic software.

It goes on.

You really need to be a good tech to be successful as a calibrationist unless you plan to only cal brand new stuff that you just read up on.

A lot of sets need calibration because there is something else wrong with it. Or it's old. Not that many dream customers around with brand new sets that think they NEED calibration.

It's a tough one.... and it is a niche market. I genuinely got lucky that I do what I do and live in Holliwood. Dumb luck.
I'd probably be fixing computers were I to live elsewhere.
The funny thing is: I NEVER wanted to work on displays. I come from Sony's broadcast tape service. 3/4, betacam.... etc. I was actually coerced into fixing monitors. It turns out I'm so good at it that it became my living.

So what's your angle on this, klover?

Marc

[JustGreg]

Tinman, I'm not going to quote your entire post but hearing your insider opinions made me wonder if you could answer a couple questions for me:

1) Given how 'todays' TV technology is mostly above and beyond the skills of the general population, (we know it's more than just TV, but for the sake of this question we'll assume you're replying to someone who thinks of broadcast/delivered media to be 'just' TV), don't you think there's more of a need for ISF setup technicians for those wanting the most from their flat panel display than at any other time in 'TV" history?

and

2) Are the majority of displays designed to allow for 'under the hood' calibration that will permit the successful application of current ISF calibration standards?

Sounds like a tough gig to make it in but I wonder if it isn't easier to succeed in it from a business point with a greater chance of success than say 20 years ago when you banged on someones door and announced yourself in a gruff voice as "TV SETUP GUY".

Greg

[Tinman]

1) Possibly

2) No. In fact, mostly the opposite. Only the higher end sets even HAVE service menus. The average flat panel is factory flashed and that's it. You need a computer, a special interface, and EXPENSIVE software to even touch them.

It sucks!

Marc

[Fujifrontier]

[perisoft]

[Tinman]

[stefuel]

I need to spend some quality time supporting single moms