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B-Swank
Joined: 24 Nov 2007
Posts: 12
TV/Projector: barco 808s
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 3:46 am Post subject: Klipsch Good or bad |
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I went out recently to look for a new sound system to replace my 8 year old Phillips theater in a box system (not good for a brand new 10.5 x 18 theater room). After doing some limited research was leaning toward Klipsch rf-83 which is a very nice floorstanding system. The price shocked me and nearly electrocuted my wife! Do you get what you pay for? Or am I going to be throwing money down a drain? Looking for some input on Klipsch. Thanks B- Swank
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NateTTU
Joined: 14 Feb 2007
Posts: 297
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:01 am Post subject: |
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B-Swank,
Klipsch is a reputable company. Just to point out an option, not for everyone, but for those who have the equipment and just like doing things themselves I would highly suggest diy speakers. Ever since I went diy I will never go back to manufactured ones. The price to performance ratio is amazing (compared to higher end speakers). This isn't an option for everyone so if this is not the case I would recommend Axiom, SVS, and AV123. They all have great products and offer some really decent deals on a large range of budget options. Again Klipsch is a very decent speaker company and I know people around these forums have them but they do have a tendency to be too bright in my opinion. But overall if your looking for a good bang for the buck take a serious look at some of the online manufactures. Not sure if this is much help but others will soon chime in.
Nate
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perisoft
Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 4:45 am Post subject: |
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I'm insanely happy with a hodgepodge of Cerwin Vegas and a few frankensubs I put together - two VS120s in the front, and a small center and surrounds which, in true Vega style, put out more low end than is reasonable for their size (which makes them adequate in this case).
Total cost - a trade of Altec Lansings plus $45.
I'd love to get another VS120 for the center, but space/dollar constraints say otherwise for the moment. But if you want unbeatable price/performance, ... well, it's hard to beat a total of about $200 including amps for 1000 RMS watts of headroom...
All depends on the budget and time. If budget is any consideration, though, I'd strongly recommend scouring Craigslist for a while, if you're in a good sized city; people are nearly throwing away every pair of big speakers they've got in favor of crap HTiaB, at pennies or nothing on the dollar.
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oliverg
Joined: 15 May 2007
Posts: 800
Location: Melbourne, Australia
TV/Projector: Sony G90 X2 - Vidikron Vision 1
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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They make excellent speakers!
If you have time/friendly dealer, go have a listen to some Martin Logans.
Whatever choice you make, having an audition of them IMHO is highly advisable.
Take your time, if you're spending that much money - make sure you'll be happy with what you're going to be buying! 
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GEBrown
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 729
Location: Denver
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:12 pm Post subject: |
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I have about the same size HT as you do and I have been shopping for speakers. I am mostly interested in a 3.0 or 3.1 set to upgrade what I already have and then upgrade the surrounds later.
Fry's has Polk Audio RTi8's on sale right now for $149 each plus shipping. They are a tower speaker, but get great reviews. My concern is that they may be "too much" for our sized HT's - though I'm not sure what "too much" means - I'm embarrassed to ask that question in the Polk Audio forum on AVS 
(http://shop3.outpost.com/{AN3bUjVTcsEASs-tyRG3TA**.node3}/search?search_type=regular&sqxts=1&query_string=Polk+Audio&cat=&submit.x=13&submit.y=10)
You would want to match the CSi3 or CSi5 center channel with those. I believe Polk also has a promotion on right now to offer a free PSW10 sub when you spend $499 or more on other speakers. I think Fry's supports that, but you have to talk to a CSR I think.
AVS123.com also seems to have some good speakers - the x-series looks good though I'm not sure about if the are too big for our size HT's.
Just what I've found lately.
Good luck and let us know what you decide on.
Gary
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 9:49 pm Post subject: |
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| GEBrown wrote: |
AVS123.com also seems to have some good speakers - the x-series looks good though I'm not sure about if the are too big for our size HT's. |
The X-series is about the best reviewed speaker in its price range. Another good bet is the SVS system.
And Gary, funny how your fingers are trained to type "A - V - S". The site is av123.com.
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A train station is where the train stops. A bus station is where the bus stops. On my desk, I have a work station....
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paw
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: Arvada, CO
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:39 pm Post subject: |
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B-Swank
Here's an mail I sent to Gary about the X series
| Quote: | Take a look at AV123's X series speakers
http://www.av123.com/products_category_brand.php?section=speakers&brand=55
I've got the a pair of original X-LS monitors and a X-CS center. They are quite nice! They have been replaced with the Encore series. It has a better tweeter and crossover. The originals were a little laid back or weak in the higher frequences. The Encore is supposed to address this. They will have an upgrade kit for my version. I'll be doing that plus some cabinet resonance material. The monitors are LARGE. They are not bookshelf sized. Decent bass. Great sounding with drums. Especially congo type. Smooth high end. They've gotten great reviews and won a couple of awards. The mid range was a little weak when I compared them to Dragan's Quad speakers. But his speakers were much more expensive. The X-LS is $300 a pair for stain black. A nice, smooth painted finish. Various REAL wood veneers are $350 a pair. The X-SLS is a floor stander version of the X-LS. It goes a little lower. $399 in stain black, $499 in wood for a pair. The center X-CS is a 2 woofer, 1 tweeter version of the X-LS. $199 in satin black, $249 in wood each. Several people have used it as a left and right with good results. The X-MTM is a floor stander version of the X-CS or a double woofer version of the X-SLS. Some people have found it's bass a little to much or boomy. $549 in satin black, $649 in wood; a pair. The only thing their missing is a surround speaker. Something is coming. No ETA yet and limited #s to be produced. It will be called the X-S but I'm not sure how it will work out. It will have a top/bottom mounted woofer and downward/topward angled tweeter. The tweeter and woofer and to be different that the other speakers in the X series. For movie surrounds, it will not likely make a difference. It would with multi channel music (SACD, DVD-A). The Axiom QS speaker are supposed to REAL good surrounds. Here's their link http://axiomaudio.c om/surroundspeakers.html Of course, the QS speakers have upward and downward woofers but they have front and back angled tweeters. Like bi/di poles speakers would. I think that's the key for good movie surround sound. It's more diffused sound and not easily located sound.
Audioadvisor, a site that Dragan recommended, has stands that will work well with the X-LS
http://www.audioadvisor.com/prodinfo.asp?number=ENCST
$30 + $15 shipping is a steal. I got a pair. The do need to be modified to seal a couple holes and sand filled to support the X-LS. There was also a Launch Pad accessory from AV123 that bolted to the bottom of the X-LS to make mounting easier. I'll be modifying that to fit on these stand. I don't see it on AV123's site any more. You'd have to call them to see if they are still available and if the Encore series has the mounting holes. I'm assuming the new Encore series still has the mount holes on the bottom. Here's a couple of pics
http://www.av123.com/images_dynamic/gallery/furniture_9_4.jpg
"Stand not included"
http://www.av123.com/images_dynamic/gallery/furniture_9_3.jpg
Of course AV123 offers a complete stand
http://www.av123.com/products_product.php?section=furniture&product=9.1
It's $130
They have a kick ass sub called the MWF-15. It's BIG! It's not listed in their store but is available. The prices were $600 each or $1000 a pair. I think the prices may have gone up. There's a slightly smaller but longer sub called the x-plosive. A 10" woofer and 12" passive radaitor. I don't think it's available yet. Both will be/are available in satin black and the same wood finishes as the X series.
The best part of AV123, their warehouse is in Longmont, CO. You can pick 'em up there. The 2nd best part is their customer service. It's top notch. The 3rd best part, 30 day return policy. The bad part is their inventory control. They are sold out a lot of times.
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OH! I forgot to mention if you buy multiple speakers, you get a discount. I'd guess in the 5 - 10% range. They call this the "family discount". From then on, you get the "family discount". You may be able to do better if you call an chat with the sales reps. Jess Q is a friend. He's quite knowledgable. He use to work for NHT speakers. He's a high school band director and knows good sound. I know several of the other guys but not as well. Hell! Sometime you even get to talk to the owner Mark Schifter. If you can get ahold of him, you sometimes can get smoking deals. He's a great guy.
I'd recommend going to av123.com/forum and searching or asking about the Polks. Most people there are honest about
speaker evaluations. Though, there are some fanboys on the forum. If you do open a thread there, let me know and I'll be happy to help you shift the chaff from the wheat.
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Aubrey
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paw
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: Arvada, CO
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| Posted: Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:41 pm Post subject: |
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Part II
For most speakers, if you have 2 - 3' from the side walls you're fine. 1- 3' from the back walls needed also.
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Aubrey
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myndex
Joined: 22 Jun 2008
Posts: 18
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| Posted: Tue Jun 24, 2008 10:43 pm Post subject: |
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I like Klipsch horn loaded speakers because most theaters use some form of horn loaded speaker arrangement, and as a result, Klipsch seem to emulate the sound of a theater more than other "home" speakers.
FWIW modern theaters seem to be using JBL horn loaded arrays. Or perhaps more to the point, the dub stages (the theater where the film is actually mixed) here in Hollywood tend to use JBL horn loaded arrays.
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Bucketfoot
Joined: 17 Mar 2006
Posts: 698
Location: Centennial, CO
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 1:00 am Post subject: |
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I would also have no issues recommending the x-series speakers. I have 4 X-LS, 1 X-CS and 1 X-Sub (also using a pair of Wharfedale WH-2 bipole side surrounds).
My room is ~13' x 19' and I have absolutely loved the performance. The only thing I may change is to get a more powerful sub (although my wife would not agree), in which case the X-Sub will be moved to the family room.
DIY is probably the only thing that can beat these for bang for the buck.
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overclkr
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 4227
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:18 am Post subject: |
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Left, Center, and Right KLF-30's in the house here..........
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greg_mitch
Joined: 03 May 2006
Posts: 5320
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 1:00 pm Post subject: |
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The x-series are nice and an excellent bang for your buck. I have never heard them but have heard that the Rocket series are a step above. 
I have some AV123 Rockets (4x RS150, RSC200). I have an MFW15 on the way for the boom department.
Check out the classifieds ads at AV123 and you will see there are some great deals to be had in the used area over there. Their audience tends to constantly upgrade.
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator
Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah
TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010
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| Posted: Wed Jun 25, 2008 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| myndex wrote: | | I like Klipsch horn loaded speakers because most theaters use some form of horn loaded speaker arrangement, and as a result, Klipsch seem to emulate the sound of a theater more than other "home" speakers. |
Does your room also emulate the sound of a 35'x90' room with 25' ceilings? Do you have 150 seats with full floor-to-ceiling acoustic treatment? Speakers sound completely different depending on the room they're in, so saying Klipsch's "emulate the theater sound" just because they're horn-loaded is silly.
| myndex wrote: | | FWIW modern theaters seem to be using JBL horn loaded arrays. Or perhaps more to the point, the dub stages (the theater where the film is actually mixed) here in Hollywood tend to use JBL horn loaded arrays. |
Theaters have and still use horn-loaded arrays because they're highly efficient, requiring MUCH less amplifier power than would a set of direct radiators. They have to be efficient because of the size of the space and because the room is HIGHLY absorptive. It has to be absorptive or RT60 (reverb) would be horrible. It would cost much, much, much more in amplifier power to drive direct radiators to the same reference levels in that large, highly absorptive space.
Large horn arrays also provide dispersion characteristics suitable for large spaces - wide horizontal dispersion to cover a large area and narrow vertical dispersion to reduce ceiling reflection. As for the dubbing stages, they all use a variety of speaker designs, depending on the size of the room, the treatments, etc. It's simply not true to say that "dubbing stages in Hollywood tend to use JBL horn loaded arrays."
The bottom line is with good design and in proper environments, horns and direct radiators can both sound very "neutral" and can both sound very similar. The risk with horns is that people usually use them smaller, untreated (or incorrectly treated) rooms. As a result, you get people who dislike horns, complaining about sound that's way too "bright", "forward", "in your face" or "honky". Then, you have horn fans who are get used to that way-too-bright sound that then bad-mouth direct radiators as being "way too laid-back", "too soft", not accurate, or as sounding like "home" speakers - when usually bad horn/crossover design or bad room treatments are to blame for their perception of what "proper" sound is.
SC
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enigma
Joined: 20 Feb 2008
Posts: 24
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 12:55 pm Post subject: |
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Hey Guys, Klipsch is a renowned company that has been around a long time, their early speakers from 50's to 70's were fully horn loaded and guess what? they still make the original models!
The old designs are their heritage series and still sound fantastic.
Obviously they also have modern design series to compete with other brands and the only part that is horn loaded in these is the tweeter.
Not all speakers from the different manufacturers will be great, like cars, there will be some models that will be ho hum. Best to listen to the ones that fit into your criteria & judge them.
I have a Klipsch KSW12 subwoofer that has been around for 7 years because it is still soooo good.
Now going back to the floor standers, they are highly sensitive which is great news if you use low wattage amplifiers. Being horn loaded they could be considered bright sounding, so partner them with with equipment that is not harsh sounding or look at dulling the room acoustics a bit. Valve amplifiers suit them.
As audio is subjective & personal, if you like the sound of them, buy them.
The best way to audition them is not by watching a movie on them, take your favourite CD & listen to it carefully. Always play the same track between speakers & then you will know which sounds best.
Cheers!
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emdawgz1
Joined: 14 Mar 2006
Posts: 7949
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| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 1:12 pm Post subject: |
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Klipsch make a good speaker. Well designed and constructed. It's not my cup of tea though.
If you are looking for a speaker on a budget, i think an earlier post suggested axiom or av123. Not bad choices.
I think you should set a budget for the whole deal... Receiver, wiring, speakers, etc then find a receiver in the budget.
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paw
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1176
Location: Arvada, CO
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| Posted: Tue Jul 08, 2008 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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AV123 was selling Denon AVRs as part of speaker package deals. You had to be "in the know" and ask about them.
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Aubrey
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