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All the Gamma, All the Time

 
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Moose



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 788
Location: Minnesota

Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 1:54 pm    Post subject: All the Gamma, All the Time

It is my understanding that the gamma correction included in products by Moome and Beun and whoever else only offer correction on part of the curve. Why is this? Is it difficult to apply gamma correction over the entire curve? Is there any real advantage to doing so? Do scalers that offer gamma correction operate over the entire curve or are they limited only to part of it also?

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In the real world, I am alan halvorson, King of the Wild Frontier and Swell Guy.
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Ile



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland

Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 2:26 pm    Post subject: Re: All the Gamma, All the Time

Moose wrote:
It is my understanding that the gamma correction included in products by Moome and Beun and whoever else only offer correction on part of the curve. Why is this? Is it difficult to apply gamma correction over the entire curve? Is there any real advantage to doing so? Do scalers that offer gamma correction operate over the entire curve or are they limited only to part of it also?
Because gamma performance is limited only in lower end in most projectors. If you boost also mid range gamma, picture look washed out. All this depend about your projector. Some projectors don't need correction at all and some might need correction also for mid range.

Old scalers and video card drivers have only feature to adjust whole scale gamma correction. Basically you adjust midpoint of the curve, but it also effect little to low and high end.

Few new scaler and some video card drivers have ability to adjust gamma where you like. For example you can boost below IRE10 shades...
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ecrabb
Forum Moderator


Joined: 13 Mar 2006
Posts: 15909
Location: Utah

TV/Projector: JVC RS40, Epson 5010

Posted: Tue Sep 11, 2007 2:34 pm    Post subject:

The Moome and Beun gamma functions control only low-IRE values by design - because that's where CRTs have the least linear response. Because of CRT's low-IRE non-linear response, low IRE's (shadows) are where greyscale tracking goes to hell. As a side benefit of focusing only on the low-end, it allows us to lower G2 enough reduce black to a true black level, while using the gamma correct to boost above-black levels to the appropriate level. Without gamma correction, all low-level black shades would be "crushed" together - as in all the same level - black.

Several of the high-end scalers do allow full gamma control over the full 0-100 IRE.

SC
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perisoft



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY

Posted: Thu Sep 13, 2007 11:30 pm    Post subject:

If you use an HTPC running, say, Zoomplayer, or other software which supports ffdshow, you get full per-channel level control, so instead of just a gamma setting, you can graphically boost/cut bits of the curve - rather like the difference between a volume knob (regular gamma) a bass knob (low end gamma) and a 12-band EQ (ffdshow).

Horrible pain to set up, but the control is great. Smile
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Moose



Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 788
Location: Minnesota

Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:20 am    Post subject:

Quote:
Horrible pain to set up, but the control is great


But is the result worth the effort? Doubtful I will go this route, but I'm curious.

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perisoft



Joined: 29 Aug 2007
Posts: 2920
Location: Ithaca, NY

Posted: Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:43 am    Post subject:

I don't think I'm experienced enough at this to offer a really reliable answer, but I know that in my case - where I'm working with a PJ that has some serious problems due to a toasty blue tube - it gives me the flexibility to go from a godawful image to a pretty damned good one. There's absolutely no way the PJ would throw a remotely acceptable image without a lot of software tweaks.

That said, I have a reasonable amount of experience with photoshop, image processing, and photography, so the groundwork I've already done is a huge help. Starting from zero a priori knowledge in a related field, and being uncomfortable with PCs and software setup, I tend to think it would only be worthwhile if you want to eke the last bit of performance out or if you have a projector with some nasty flaws you need to correct.

With a good PJ, little experience, and some cash to get off the rack solutions, you'll probably find that the best option.

But, like I said, I don't really know my ass from my elbow in this business yet, so take what I say with a grain of salt. Smile

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