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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 4:07 pm Post subject: BG1208 problems. Need more tips on blooming. |
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I have two pj's, one BG1208 and one BG1208/2.
They both have some problems but not the same, so i like info how to put one perfect together..
The first, BG1208:
It has some fault that makes the spotkiller or what it's called, not to shut down the beam on BLUE, but ONLY when configured for ceiling mounting.
I have terribly burnmarked a NEW tube this way.
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/08-cont%2077.JPG
When table configured it works as it should (it seems this far).
It also has visible retrace lines on the tube on all tubes. (pictures taken into the lens at low bright and contrast)
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/08-g-tracelines.JPG
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/08-r-tracelines.JPG
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/08-b-tracelines.JPG
Other than this no imageproblems. No blooming or bluebanding.
Almost new RED and GREEN tube.
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/08%20bloom%20contr%2078.JPG
It does however take 20-30seconds to turn on after remotepress. This happened relatively suddenly.
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BG1208/2 this one i use ceiling mounted but have other problems with.
It is also this one i want to fix.
I have big problems with bleeding blue over 50 contrast. Also in some scenes i get big blueish bands over the entire image. Sometimes the WHOLE image gets blueish. Very ANNOYING.
(SAME image paused and on the SAME input 3)
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/08-2%20blooming%20contr%2060.JPG
It also when switching from relatively low resolutions/refreshrates to higher ones (1920x1080) the beams turn on before the focus circuits have stablized the image. When looking at it the focus is way off and the image then focuses and shrinks to nomal size under aproximately 1-2 seconds.
So i usually "blank" the image on the remote before this happens.
So, what i want to know is WHY and HOW i fix it. Which boards to move eventually?
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
Last edited by ncc1701d on Sun Aug 12, 2007 3:05 pm; edited 1 time in total
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 7:00 pm Post subject: Re: BG1208 problems |
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| ncc1701d wrote: | I have big problems with bleeding blue over 50 contrast. Also in some scenes i get big blueish bands over the entire image. Sometimes the WHOLE image gets blueish. Very ANNOYING.
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Try other neck card to blue first, 1208 should have same card.
My BG1200 do that same focus thing, so I can't say is that fault or feature.  Also switching projector on seems pretty rough and slow compared to my 801s.
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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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Should have said so in the main post, that i HAVE tried swapping neckboard with no difference..
The switch-on time was as short as on my 08/2 before (instant). It just happened pretty suddenly.
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
Last edited by ncc1701d on Thu Aug 09, 2007 6:31 pm; edited 2 times in total
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 6:14 pm Post subject: |
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Have you tried to swap driver or input board?
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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 6:23 pm Post subject: |
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No haven't tried that.. which is the driverboard then?
Is that the R7621175 (RGB driver + Quad)?
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:29 pm Post subject: |
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| ncc1701d wrote: | No haven't tried that.. which is the driverboard then?
Is that the R7621175 (RGB driver + Quad)? |
Yes, that one.
Main board is driver where gain adjustments (contrast and black/white balance) are done to rgb signals. Sub board is decoder for composite/s-video.
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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Sat Aug 11, 2007 7:20 pm Post subject: No difference |
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I have now tried swapping the RGB driver board and another neckcard again, but the bleeding is still the same.
I checked the gain setting for blue in the colortemp menu at 9500k wich i use.
And blue was at 100, red at 45.
If i set it at 50/50 as the old, the image gets very yellowish..
On the old 1208 it is 50 on both for 9500k.
Could it be that the blue tube is so toasted it wont help unless i change blue tube?
Anything else i could check?
Check this pic, it shows very good how it looks att diff contrasts..
Look at the face and upper right part how blue it gets..
http://www.anderserlandsson.se/rgbconv/Projektor/BG1208-2_contrast.jpg
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2007 10:38 am Post subject: |
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Need more tips..
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2007 12:30 pm Post subject: |
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Have you checked G2 adjustments?
After that you should adjust gray scale using custom white and custom black adjustments. Those preadjusted settings aren't newer spot on in old projectors. Different softwares have different values for those preadjusted settings. Usually 6500K is good starting point for custom adjustment. Gray fields or vertical gray step pattern is good for adjustment.
If you end up with blue white balance to 100 like in 9500K, blue tube might have low emission. That is easy to test with your other blue tube...
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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2007 8:37 pm Post subject: |
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no i havent checked G2 yet. That is completely different from the settings on the neckboard right? (the small pots)
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Mon Aug 13, 2007 11:44 pm Post subject: |
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| ncc1701d wrote: | | no i havent checked G2 yet. That is completely different from the settings on the neckboard right? (the small pots) |
Those trimpots are for G2 refine...
Here is adjustment process:
Project for example 20% pluge pattern from DVE or some other test picture you know have video black (0 IRE) in it.
Color balance/ cut off levels to default. (just press 6500K)
Contrast to 0 and brightness to 50.
Look into each lens, video black part of that test picture should be barely visible. (equally in every tube)
If not, G2 voltages need to be adjusted.
Turn refine trimpots on each video output board to 50%.
Short out the pins on top of each video output board (next to rca connector) using jumpers. Turn G2 pots (P2, P3 and P4 next to diagnostic leds in G2/diagnostic board) so that video black is barely visible in every tube.
Remove jumpers and refine from amp pots if needed.
After that grayscale adjustment using custom white/black from menu.
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ncc1701d
Joined: 08 Aug 2007
Posts: 187
Location: sweden
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| Posted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:38 am Post subject: |
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Ok thanks.
Do i need any special refreshrate or can i run the test pic on the computer at 1920x1080i ?
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BG1208 and BG1208/2
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Tue Aug 14, 2007 10:41 am Post subject: |
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| ncc1701d wrote: | | Do i need any special refreshrate or can i run the test pic on the computer at 1920x1080i ? |
That's fine.
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 9:23 pm Post subject: |
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The bleeding of a color is usually a tracking problem. What ever color is bleeding is the gun that is not tracking properly, in this case blue, meaning the problem is more then likely the blue tube. Did you try replaceing it with the other tube yet. Good Luck.
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rod
Joined: 18 Mar 2006
Posts: 418
Location: Northern Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 11:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Ile wrote: | Those trimpots are for G2 refine...
Here is adjustment process:
Project for example 20% pluge pattern from DVE or some other test picture you know have video black (0 IRE) in it.
Color balance/ cut off levels to default. (just press 6500K)
Contrast to 0 and brightness to 50.
Look into each lens, video black part of that test picture should be barely visible. (equally in every tube)
If not, G2 voltages need to be adjusted.
Turn refine trimpots on each video output board to 50%.
Short out the pins on top of each video output board (next to rca connector) using jumpers. Turn G2 pots (P2, P3 and P4 next to diagnostic leds in G2/diagnostic board) so that video black is barely visible in every tube.
Remove jumpers and refine from amp pots if needed.
After that grayscale adjustment using custom white/black from menu. |
Where are those "trimpots" that need adjusting to 50%. Can I assume these "trimpots" are the same as the "amp pots"?
Is there a procedure for grayscale adj and do you need a color meter?
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Rod
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Sat Aug 25, 2007 8:10 pm Post subject: |
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| rod wrote: | | Where are those "trimpots" that need adjusting to 50%. Can I assume these "trimpots" are the same as the "amp pots"? |
Yes those same pots next to rca's over amps.
| rod wrote: | | Is there a procedure for grayscale adj and do you need a color meter? |
Can be done by eye, but you need some test picture.
Here is something, it's for 800 but after G2 adjustment it's same.
http://www.curtpalme.com/ES_Tube_Projector_Gray_Scale_Adjustment1.shtm
You should get pretty good result just with 20 % and 80 % gray fields. Adjust 20 % field as neutral gray as possible using custom black adjustments and 80 % field with custom white adjustments.
If you have problems to see what is neutral gray, you can try this. Cover blue tube when fine adjusting red white/black balance and try to adjust grey fields as yellowish as possible. Same thing with blue, cover red tube and try to adjust grey as cyan as you can. Use same 20/80 IRE fields for that too.
After grayscale adjustments it's needed to check brightness adjustment.
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