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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 5:37 pm Post subject: DAMN!! My PG10plus died! |
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It's certainly a rare moment to find ME here asking for ideas....
My Runco990, aka PG10 plus has died on me!
It ran perfectly a few months ago, but this time the projector turns on and no image.
So far I have verified that the HV comes up but then shuts down in a few seconds. I have run this by Curt as well, btw....
Things I have tested:
Swapped HV supply - not it.
Swapped Deflection board - not it.
Swapped Video out board - not it.
Disconnected each CRT in turn - not it.
Disconnected the C and F drives - not it.
Tried different System boards - not it.
Swapped main Power Supply - not it.
The projector goes through the sync changes when I apply a signal, so it seems the system boards are ok.
I'm running out of ideas on this one.... it quite literally died from one use to the next.
I'm suspecting the HV splitter block may be failing, as the HV detect and HV shutdown are also sensed from it, but that's the ONE part I don't have a spare of. Dammit!
As Curt suggested, NEC's have a solid HV section and rarely ever fail. So this one has me scratching my head.
Thought I'd toss it up here in case anyone else has run into a sudden HV sutdown issue.
Marc
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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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You can check the voltage feedback at the HV powersupply "KR" "KS". TP5502 is the protect test point, ther are several things what you can measure at the HV board -based on plain PG powersupply schematics. I have a full set HV section for plain PG, but I live in Hungary, basically you can get it for free if you cover the shipping costs, if no one has one nearer to you. 
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projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 12:13 am Post subject: |
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Did you disconnect those screen control lines from the neckboards when you did that test? Are the heaters still glowing when the HV goes down? How about the fans, still running after shutdown? No codes I presume?
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 2:12 am Post subject: |
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Yep, no codes, heaters still hot. The projector seems to run as usual, minus HV.
I'm going to try my hunch as soon as I can get a HV splitter. These things used to go out in RP TV's as well.
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 10:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | Yep, no codes, heaters still hot. The projector seems to run as usual, minus HV.
I'm going to try my hunch as soon as I can get a HV splitter. These things used to go out in RP TV's as well. |
Post your results after the splitter change. I'm curious.
Did you replace the HV board and the FBT board for your tries?
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:27 pm Post subject: |
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Replaced the HV board, yes.
I'll try to pick up a splitter asap and see. I don't think it's the FBT board as I do get HV and no arcing whatsoever.
The splitter has a high ohm resistor built into it for voltage reference to the HV board. I think it's my best bet.
Marc
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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While you're waiting, try wiggling the FBT HV lead slightly out of the boot of the splitter. If the HV stays up, you should be able to hear HV arcing between the lead and the splitter connection. If it goes down, then it will stop.
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Tue May 15, 2012 12:16 am Post subject: |
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Both flybacks have sense lines which also include G2 for the screen controls to shut down HV.
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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| macgyver655 wrote: | | Both flybacks have sense lines which also include G2 for the screen controls to shut down HV. |
You may be right, I have replaced the HV combiner and the 3 way splitter.... No joy.
Tried pulling the G2 and even the HV lines on each tube, one by one.... Same thing.
HV "Whoosh" when it starts, no arcing anywhere... and then slight "tick" as the HV shuts down.
The weird thing is that this happened between the time I last shut it down from normal use and the next time I fired it up.
Gremlins?
Marc
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 7:52 pm Post subject: |
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I remember having a problem just as you. And then I grabbed a ladder, climbed up and looked through the lenses at the tube faces. Needless to say, my problem was a IMPLODED TUBE!!! Yep, that'll keep the HV from coming up 
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A Barco is only a AmPro with training wheels
Card carrying member of the AVS chain gang.
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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Not an imploded tube. This is a 9" LC projector with rubber expansion bellows.
And I pulled the HV and G2's per tube to test.
This one is WEIRD!!!!
Marc
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hansilili
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 302
Location: Köln, Germany
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 8:52 pm Post subject: |
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You have my condolences for sure. Other than a spare 10PG unit with white tubes there is no help I can offer to you.
Cheers
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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Well.... it's NOT the Flybacks either.
I have now replaced every part in the damn thing.
Seriously, if I can't figure this out I'm buying a digital.
This is just.... NUTS!
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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Then you need to check the 110v and 15v supply voltage to the HV board. It may be being drawn down somewhere else just enough not to trigger a code but shut down the HV.
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 10:04 pm Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | Well.... it's NOT the Flybacks either.
I have now replaced every part in the damn thing.
Seriously, if I can't figure this out I'm buying a digital.
This is just.... NUTS! |
STEP BACK and TAKE A DEEP BREATH. No need to commit suicide just yet. 
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 10:48 pm Post subject: |
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Well...f*ck!?
So I measured the 15 and 110v lines. 15volt ok. But I couldn't get to the 110V line (on the HV supply) so I slightly pulled out the connector to get a meter probe in there.
Turned the set back on and HV CRACK! But louder! PICTURE!!! WTF?
Mind you I replaced the HV power supply twice! So I did have to pull and re-insert the connectors several times.....
I am now wondering if the 110v pin on the connector is flaky. It does feel a bit loose.
It's running, so I'll look at the pins and tighten them down a bit and see if the set keeps running.
Fer Christ's sake! A CABLE????
OK, I am so glad the damn thing wasn't on the ceiling....
Marc
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Thu May 17, 2012 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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Cool. At least your on the right track now. 
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 12:44 am Post subject: |
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Well, looks like it WAS the cable from the mother board to the HV supply.
It crapped out again, and I could get it working again by wiggling the connector.
A little deoxit seems to now have fixed it.
Would NOT have thought of that one up front... ever.
Marc
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 1:21 pm Post subject: |
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Another CRT saved..... YEAH!........
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Fri May 18, 2012 3:38 pm Post subject: |
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| macgyver655 wrote: | | Another CRT saved..... YEAH!........ |
Oh geez.... tell me about it. Sheer panic and cold terror came over me when that beast wouldn't start!
And that right after I finally got a spare green and blue tube from Curt!
Now I've fixed a few of these and contain a lot of Doug's knowledge on the projectors..... but THIS one had me baffled.
And sure enough, it was something idiotically simple.
I guess oxidation never stops.
On the bright side.... I did swap out a few caps here and there in the process.
Marc
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