CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[PaulB]

Strange one this.

I've just hooked up my Satellite box to the Marquee using an HDMI balun and 30m of Cat6 into a Moome Vin-HD. Now, I get a perfect picture at 576p but switching to a Hi-Def channel at 720p or 1080i I get a scrambled picture - wtf!

I've checked the actual balun and it works perfectly when attached to my TV so I'm not quite sure whats going on here (Balun is rated at upto 60m for 1080i). Cat6 cable must be ok otherwise I'd not get a picture at 576p presumably.

The pj is working fine, the Balun works fine so I'm not sure quite whats going on (HTPC into the VIM-HD works perfectly at 1080i/1080p but I need to double check this as its a week or so since I last used it).

Anyone ever had this sort of problem before? Don't think its a sync issue as there aren't any "No Sync" errors on the pj??

I obviously need to investigate further but just wondered if anyone had a quick answer?

[Nashou66]

the Marquee i think needs up to a 5 volt sync signal and the video must be close to 1 v, does the balun say how much the voltage outputs are for each? It could also be that the cat 6 is not thick enough to carry the bandwidth. try doubling up of the cat 6, run two sets next to each other and splice each strand to the same color for the second run of cat 6. But this is just a theory. What brand balun are you using to send the video?

also try differnt power ups of the equipment.

it is weird as 576p is a bit higher bandwidth than 1080i(540p)

Athanasios

[PaulB]

Its one of these OEM clone Baluns I got off EBay - http://tinyurl.com/589p9l
no real documentation to speak of so no details on signal voltage. I tested it before installation using the exact same Cat6 cables that I put in the walls - it worked perfectly on the TV at 1080i - wasn't able to test it on the pj though until after installation.

I suspect that it may very well be that its the output voltage (good thinking on your part Athanasios). Not that it will help trace that particular issue but I'll try to move the TV into the projector room and attach it to the projector end and check if the balun works ok still on the TV, if that does work (and I rather think it will) that does sort of leave the output voltage as the culprit I think.

Like you say, weird that 576p works but 1080i does not

Would perhaps routing the balun through say a video processor work? As luck would have it I sold my Lumagen last month

Tried my spare VIM and CLM as well just in case but exact same problem.

[Nashou66]

Man you sold the lumie! CRT definitly needs a VP in my opinion i bet if you had it trhough thaat it be no issue, my LG Bh100 wont work into the moome unless the Lumie is in the chain, i get exactly what you described.

Athanasios

[PaulB]

[PaulB]

Tested the Sat box connected directly to the Marquee and it works fine. Put the Balun between the pj and the Sat box and I get a scrambled picture at 1080i. Blast.

Easiest solution is a Lumagen, cheapest way is to move Sat box to pj room but lots of hassle involved rerouting the cables I just installed throughout the house. Might have to sit tight for a while before which solution is best, neither is particularly appealing for obvious reasons.

Bloody nightmare this is especially with Christmas fast approaching

[Nashou66]

Yeah some of those baluns on E-bay are not the best. I have not tried any but i do want to eventually when i get another HD tv fro my bed room. i want to spit the ignal and send one to my theater where i now have the sat box wich i'll move to the bed room and send a signal to the theater as well once the move is made. I hear the audio authority one is good.

God luck paul

nashou

[PaulB]

My Sat Box also has component output so I'll make up some Cat5 component cables and try that tomorrow. Not as good as HDMI of course but if it works it will do nicely until I get a better Balun, move the Sat box or get another Lummie!

Fingers crossed.

I would say that the cheap EBay HDMI baluns and splitters do work, just not with the marquee unfortunately. For a TV they are perfect - I tested the Baluns on a 30m run of Cat5 and Cat6 (whilst the Cat5/6 was still coiled up) and I saw no difference in the picture on my 55" SXRD TV - very impressed for such a low cost.

Curse the marquee for being so picky Anyway, I opened up the balun to see if there was a way to change the output signal but all I saw was a circuit board, a single chip and a few small smd's and resistors - I wouldn't pay a lot of money for these things, they are clearly very cheap to make, maybe even make one yourself?

[JustGreg]

Hi Paul
Donchya just hate it when you sell something that you don't 'think' you'll need any more? I've done it more than once! I blame it on this Rain Man OCD hatred of clutter I have. Damn you Tom Cruise! (He has nothing to do with it...I just don't like him)

I'm using the ebay item below for a different twist on your application. I'm sending a YPbPr signal via CAT6 to an LCD monitor in the HT bathroom. The run is about 50ft and I don't have any issues. It's being fed by the component out of my Panny S97 player whilst the signal to the pj (moome v1) is via HDMI-->DVI-I adapter. In a failed attempt at frugality I tried X10 wireless AV but it looked like total crapola and dropped signal when anybody walked in front of the stream.

http://cgi.ebay.com/Component-Video-Audio-Balun-Extender-Cat-5-Wall-Plate_W0QQitemZ370099498251QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item370099498251&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1205%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318

It almost sounds like the specs are bogus for the baluns you have in that they might require an external power source to achieve the advertised distance....like the Fury's in some applications.

Good luck. You're certainly a busy boy in your HT lately. Hopefully with the onset of winter you'll get 'er dun and have some time to actually enjoy it.

[PaulB]

[Nashou66]

Paul try doubling up of the cable first, it might be the trick, those cat 6 wires are very thin.

Athanasios

[PaulB]

[PaulB]

Well, just received the component Balun, set it all up and ......... yep, that doesn't work either!

I ran the Balun through the Cat6 installed cable to the pj and got a nice picture at 576p, switched to a 1080i channel and get the exact same sqwiggly-wiggly picture that I had with 1080i through the HDMI Balun (pj reports V Sync out of range for 1080i and H Sync out of range for 720p)! I had thought it may be the cable so I plugged in a brand new Cat5e shielded cable, fed it direct from the Balun at the sat-box through the house to the Balun at the pj and got the exact same results as the HDMI Balun - so, its not the cable and its not the Baluns

I'm now beginning to wonder if its the Moome HDMI card thats the problem - I've had 1080p @60hz through it ok from the HTPC, the HD box is outputting 576p and 1080i at 50hz. So thats a fail on 1080i HDMI at 50hz via a Balun and a fail on 1080i at 50hz on a Component Balun.

Does the V Sync at 1080i and H Sync at 720p errors mean anything significant??

Next test is to somehow try to connect the HD satellite box directly to the pj at 1080i and see what happens (difficult as the box won't output anything other than menus without a direct satellite input and the satellite cable won't stretch to the pj!).

FFS, this is getting sooooo demoralising as the whole reason for getting the damn projector was to view Hi-Def from the sat-box and I can't get it to work and it really shouldn't be this difficult!

[JustGreg]

I'm sorry my suggestion led to you spending coin and it didn't correct the problem. I doubled up the cable as previously mentioned; one for video, the second for 5.1 digital audio. I'm using moome ver1 at 1080i/60. My run is ~25ft...but damnit they advertise the max runs to what...a couple hundred feet at least?

If you decide to post the baluns for sale I'll take them off your hands, unless you're going to try to return them.
I certainly didn't have to jump through hoops to get them working. If I did they'd be sitting in the 'why the f doesn't it work' box. Have you dropped moome a line yet to get his take on it?

[Nashou66]

With my Blu ray player straight to the moome i cant get it to work either, but wwith the lumagen in the chain no worries at all. I should try my Sat box directly to it.

Athanasios

[PaulB]

Back again.

No need to apologise Greg, it was definately worth a try and was cheaper than buying a Lummie, just disappointed it didn't work. Chances are I'd have bought a Component Balun anyway sooner or later so please don't beat yourself up about it.

Just tried the sat-box - I undid all the dish cables and tried it at 1080i on the TV, as expected no display other than menus at 1080i (at this point the component cables are still attached to the balun and the pj). Pj still has wiggly picture.

Attached the sat-box directly to the pj using Component cable - it works at 1080i ! Attached sat-box directly with HDMI cable - it works! Strange though, given your problems Athanasios, I hadn't expected this to work.

Obvious conclusion now is that routing the Hi-Def signal through the Baluns does not work (in my case) on the pj. Something is interfering with the signal such that it doesn't want to play. I suppose it could be the signal from the sat-box itself but having said that, routing the sat-box through the Baluns (again via 30 metres of Cat6), it all works beatifully on the TV!!??

The fact that a direct connection to the pj works does give me some hope. I can relocate the sat-box through to the projector room - not easy and means having extended cables from the dish but it will work and is realtively cheap (abslute logistical nightmare though). Other option of course is the Lummie - expensive and at this point no guarantee that it will work.

Good news bad news I suppose, leaning towards a Lummie as there is a lot of work re-routing the Sat-Box.

Weird how these digital connections desighned to make life easy suddenly make life so difficult. One foot forward........!

[Nashou66]

Just keep an eye out for a lumie with a crt paul you should have it with CRT just being able to do the Active Area Scanning with the Lumie and Blu Ray is worth it to me. Run the 2.35 movies at 800p@72 and the 1.78 at 1080p@48. Unless you have a blu player able to select 1080p@48 you get stuck with 60hz and i do not like the side to side judder, but some are not sensitive to it. I think there is a HDP on video gone now for 750, i think.

http://cgi.videogon.com/cgi-bin/cl.pl?procscal&1229638678&class&3&4&

Nashou

[PaulB]

Thanks for the link Athanasios, I'll try to get one this side of the pond first I think (Customs and shipping would likely add another $150 - $200 )

I'm still not overly convinced that its not the Moome card thats the problem, thats the two different Baluns and your Blu-Ray player that won't work without some intervention - maybe its too sensitive in the signal it needs (or maybe its perfect and its the marquee thats sensitive as you intimated earlier?)? Problem is, if its only me and you that are having these issues I can't see Moome (quite rightly) wasting time investigating this for a couple of ner-do-wells pointing fingers in possibly totally the wrong direction. Wonder if his new upcoming HD-VIM works differently from the current version?

[Nashou66]

I don't think its only the Moome HDMI sucks Period. Moome is a great guy and will help when he has time. It be nice in the future if Bly Ray players had more output options.

Nashou

[JustGreg]

It's got to be something you're overlooking because there just is no way in HELL that something actually worked for me and not for other people. When it comes to being born under a Dark Sign, I must have been one of those squalling newborns. Go 'hed, I dare ya. Go out to dinner with me and order the same food I do...it will SUCK! Even if you recommend it!

I don't know a thing about the voltage outputs of vid devices...1ppv seems to stick in my grey covered grey matter, but I'll bet the problem lies there. It's possible my VIM was repaired at one point (with an alternate component) and that's why it works??? Curiouser and curiouser.