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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:27 am Post subject: Whining NEC PG xtra power supply |
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Yesterday, and the day before yesterday my NEC's power supply gave some whining sound during the warm up, friday it went without problem. When I turned on it just started as it should (no problem) then after a minute of operation the power supply started screaming, but does not affected the picture (yesterday it wasn't dependent on projected image, but the day before that, the whining came mostly when all three tubes were on) after 2 munites or so of whining it faded away and watched the movie without any problem. The main purpose of this post is not to seek advices for this, as probably I would get "recap the power supply" and similar posts, and actually this is what I'll do, just curious if anyone ever had a similar problem with a NEC?
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projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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Never.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:02 pm Post subject: |
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Never.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:03 pm Post subject: |
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Never.
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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Location: Australia
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 12:04 pm Post subject: |
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Wow... 3 times!!
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Zolzar
Joined: 26 Jun 2009
Posts: 252
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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I have that problem on occasion. Was much worse before I recapped. After warm up though it does go away.
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Mon Jun 17, 2013 11:53 pm Post subject: |
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Guys I mentioned this in another thread and was surprised nobody even thought to recap the power supply when recapping the rest of the boards in the set when they did the boards and it sounds like this is bad caps pull the power supply and take it apart and see if it has leaking caps if yes then it needs recapping
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crt king of black
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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Location: Australia
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 12:19 am Post subject: |
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Who says i didnt? 
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 12:20 am Post subject: |
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Who says i didnt?
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 12:33 am Post subject: |
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Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap.
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 12:49 am Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap. |
I got that smell from the video board section before my video and convergence grids went black so I guess the caps on the board went(kinda surprised they lasted two days  if I can get someone to refurb the board without wording about them messing with the knobs on the board I will be happy as the rest of the caps have been replaced but I think one on the deflection board is a defective one as it still whines when I have the video input in use(and the lettering shakes on all three tubes)
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crt king of black
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 12:49 am Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap. |
I got that smell from the video board section before my video and convergence grids went black so I guess the caps on the board went(kinda surprised they lasted two days if I can get someone to refurb the board without wording about them messing with the knobs on the board I will be happy as the rest of the caps have been replaced but I think one on the deflection board is a defective one as it still whines when I have the video input in use(and the lettering shakes on all three tubes)
So far my necs power supply hasn't started screaming yet but I do plan on recapping it before it starts doing that as I wouldn't want the set to need more repair(or worse be unrepairable because of it)
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gjaky
Joined: 05 Jun 2010
Posts: 2802
Location: Budapest, Hungary
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:38 am Post subject: |
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| the big E wrote: | | Tinman wrote: | Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap. |
I got that smell from the video board section before my video and convergence grids went black so I guess the caps on the board went(kinda surprised they lasted two days if I can get someone to refurb the board without wording about them messing with the knobs on the board I will be happy as the rest of the caps have been replaced but I think one on the deflection board is a defective one as it still whines when I have the video input in use(and the lettering shakes on all three tubes)
So far my necs power supply hasn't started screaming yet but I do plan on recapping it before it starts doing that as I wouldn't want the set to need more repair(or worse be unrepairable because of it) |
It is pretty normal that you hear the deflection board working when video input selected, because the line frequency is ~15kHz is in the audible range, though recapping the deflection board is a good idea also.
_________________
projectors in the past : NEC 6-9PG xtra, Electrohome Marquee 6-7500, NEC XG 1351 LC ( with super modified Electrohome VNB neckboard !!!)
current: VDC Marquee 9500LC
The MOD: VNB-DB, VIM-DB
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:44 am Post subject: |
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| gjaky wrote: | | the big E wrote: | | Tinman wrote: | Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap. |
I got that smell from the video board section before my video and convergence grids went black so I guess the caps on the board went(kinda surprised they lasted two days if I can get someone to refurb the board without wording about them messing with the knobs on the board I will be happy as the rest of the caps have been replaced but I think one on the deflection board is a defective one as it still whines when I have the video input in use(and the lettering shakes on all three tubes)
So far my necs power supply hasn't started screaming yet but I do plan on recapping it before it starts doing that as I wouldn't want the set to need more repair(or worse be unrepairable because of it) |
It is pretty normal that you hear the deflection board working when video input selected, because the line frequency is ~15kHz is in the audible range, though recapping the deflection board is a good idea also. |
Thanks for easing my worry I thought I had a defective cap(it was one of the boards he did recap when he did the set) never heard that noise from my Ecp using the composite input and wondered if he had got a bad (defective) cap for a replacement so the one thing I need to do now is figure out if my gain board is bad or needs recapping(he didn't do those boards no clue why)
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CasetheCorvetteman
Joined: 09 Nov 2008
Posts: 6326
Location: Australia
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:48 am Post subject: |
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You should hear an XG when it switches sources, youd think it was pulling in a group of contactors.
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:56 am Post subject: |
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| CasetheCorvetteman wrote: | | You should hear an XG when it switches sources, youd think it was pulling in a group of contactors. |
My nec 10pg has queiter relays the my ecp4101(you can hear it from across the room literally when I power it up(rapid fire like clicks) the nec just emits a slight click at power up)
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26706
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 6:58 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | Whining NEC PG xtra power supply |
Slap it! 
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 18, 2013 7:00 am Post subject: |
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| AnalogRocks wrote: | | Quote: | | Whining NEC PG xtra power supply |
Slap it! |
Funny 
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Tinman
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1326
Location: Carson City Nevada
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| Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:04 am Post subject: |
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| the big E wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | the big E wrote: | | Tinman wrote: | Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap. |
I got that smell from the video board section before my video and convergence grids went black so I guess the caps on the board went(kinda surprised they lasted two days if I can get someone to refurb the board without wording about them messing with the knobs on the board I will be happy as the rest of the caps have been replaced but I think one on the deflection board is a defective one as it still whines when I have the video input in use(and the lettering shakes on all three tubes)
So far my necs power supply hasn't started screaming yet but I do plan on recapping it before it starts doing that as I wouldn't want the set to need more repair(or worse be unrepairable because of it) |
It is pretty normal that you hear the deflection board working when video input selected, because the line frequency is ~15kHz is in the audible range, though recapping the deflection board is a good idea also. |
Thanks for easing my worry I thought I had a defective cap(it was one of the boards he did recap when he did the set) never heard that noise from my Ecp using the composite input and wondered if he had got a bad (defective) cap for a replacement so the one thing I need to do now is figure out if my gain board is bad or needs recapping(he didn't do those boards no clue why) |
Yes, the deflection board makes all sorts of squealing noises as it changes scan frequencies, that's normal. As long as you do NOT replace the 2 big 33uf capacitors (biggest on the board) you'll be fine. The 33uf caps are a special type, you won't find a replacement today that will hold up and not explode. They are High current, high ripple rated to couple the deflection yokes. That's also why they are so big for their value, to dissipate heat.
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the big E
Joined: 20 Apr 2013
Posts: 1928
Location: speedwell Tn.
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| Posted: Wed Jun 19, 2013 12:24 am Post subject: |
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| Tinman wrote: | | the big E wrote: | | gjaky wrote: | | the big E wrote: | | Tinman wrote: | Oh yes.... I had to change quite a few caps in my pg10. Mostly the smaller one's, they were LEAKING already. Not always visible until I un-soldered them. Failing caps make a switching PS scream. Before it fails.
The really big caps tend to fare better, but eventually they too will need replacing. Note, you must use low ESR caps in a switcher.
As the caps heat up, they regain some of their capacitance, which is why it gets better. But it's just the calm before the PS will die. Better get to it now. Easier to swap caps than IC's. BTW, you can usually smell them if you put your nose at the front vents when you first turn on the projector. Bad caps have a unique fishy smell to them.
We used to give old gear the sniff test first. If it stank, re-cap. |
I got that smell from the video board section before my video and convergence grids went black so I guess the caps on the board went(kinda surprised they lasted two days if I can get someone to refurb the board without wording about them messing with the knobs on the board I will be happy as the rest of the caps have been replaced but I think one on the deflection board is a defective one as it still whines when I have the video input in use(and the lettering shakes on all three tubes)
So far my necs power supply hasn't started screaming yet but I do plan on recapping it before it starts doing that as I wouldn't want the set to need more repair(or worse be unrepairable because of it) |
It is pretty normal that you hear the deflection board working when video input selected, because the line frequency is ~15kHz is in the audible range, though recapping the deflection board is a good idea also. |
Thanks for easing my worry I thought I had a defective cap(it was one of the boards he did recap when he did the set) never heard that noise from my Ecp using the composite input and wondered if he had got a bad (defective) cap for a replacement so the one thing I need to do now is figure out if my gain board is bad or needs recapping(he didn't do those boards no clue why) |
Yes, the deflection board makes all sorts of squealing noises as it changes scan frequencies, that's normal. As long as you do NOT replace the 2 big 33uf capacitors (biggest on the board) you'll be fine. The 33uf caps are a special type, you won't find a replacement today that will hold up and not explode. They are High current, high ripple rated to couple the deflection yokes. That's also why they are so big for their value, to dissipate heat. |
those he didn't replace so have you ever seen them fail?
I am getting some spare boards from curt so if one fails I can swap it out till I can repair the failed board
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