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CIR Engineering
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 4269
Location: Chicago USA & Berlin Germany
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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| macgyver655 wrote: | | Curt Palme wrote: |
If it is an external power supply I would have no reservations selling it to you or as a matter of fact just sending you one. But it’s an internal part and our company have liability issues to consider. Also I have no way of verifying your experience at board level repairs. I sincerely apologize for the inconvenience but I hope you understand.
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Then ask them for the schematics of the unit. There is "NO" liability there. Bet you 10 bucks I know the answer to that one already. What a pile of BS! |
+1
What a pile of horse sh*t.
I'm sure you guys know where I come down on this debate... or rather... never mind.
craigr
PS, if you have a Radiance XD and want to upgrade to an XE this requires a motherboard swap. In most cases if Jim feels that you are competent when he talks to you on the phone, he'll ship you the XE board to swap out your XD board on your own. Then you ship the XD board back to Lumagen. You have to open the entire processor and remove all the boards, then put it back together. Lumagen isn't worried about some nonexistent "liability."
_________________
JETI 1501-HiRes 2nm Spectroradiometer
JETI 1211 Spectroradiometer
Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer
Klein K10-A Colorimeter
Murideo Fresco SIX-G HDMI 2.x Multimedia Generator
Murideo Fresco SIX-A HDMI 2.x Analyzer
Light Illusion ColourSpace XPT Color Calibration Software
Light Illusion LightSpace XPT Pro Version 10.x Color Calibration Software
OMARDRIS JVC Software Patch to use K10-A and Jeti with JVC OEM AutoCal Software!
Sencore CR7000 CRT Tube Analyzer / Rejuvenater
Authorized Dealer for Lumagen & just about everything worth buying 
www.CIR-Engineering.com - craigr@cir-engineering.com
Phone: 865-405-6892
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Curt Palme
CRT Tech
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 24396
Location: Langley, BC
TV/Projector: All of them!
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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Kal can chime in, it's up to him if he wants to deal with DVDO.
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HogPilot
Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383
TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:02 pm Post subject: |
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| Curt Palme wrote: | | I have to say, I have always liked the menus on the DVDO products that I've used, they are far more consumer friendly than the Lumagen ones (IMHO) (although I've never played with anything more than the HDP units), OTOH, less friendly menus make an end user less likely to go mess around in them to screw things up... |
Totally agree - the UI on DVDO VPs is more intuitive and user friendly for the novice than on Lumagen products. And I believe that the menu system on the Vision line and the Radiance line is identical (I could be wrong on this though), so if you've seen an HDP's menus, you've seen the Radiance menus.
The only other thing that I remember being better with DVDO was their de-interlacing algorithms - the algorithms on the Gennum chip that Radiance used were't quite as robust. I believe Lumagen has made some updates to their firmware to substitute for some of the weaker Gennum algorithms, but I'll be really interested to see what VP chip they plan on using in their upcoming 4K VP.
_________________
| ecrabb wrote: | | Curt Palme wrote: | | Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure. |
He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.
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CIR Engineering
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 4269
Location: Chicago USA & Berlin Germany
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Curt Palme wrote: | | I have to say, I have always liked the menus on the DVDO products that I've used, they are far more consumer friendly than the Lumagen ones (IMHO) (although I've never played with anything more than the HDP units), OTOH, less friendly menus make an end user less likely to go mess around in them to screw things up... |
FYI Curt, the Radiance menus are much improved over the Vision line of processors.
DVDO menus still look more polished, but the Radiance has far more features so it's a lot more difficult for an end user to understand all the adjustments. The Radiance really is designed for professional installation so if you are an end user and install it yourself you must understand that there is a plethora of possibilities so you'll have to spend some time learning.
I'm sure when you visit Lumagen that Jim would give you a walk through of the menus on the Radiance. Or when you come pick up this 909 I'd be happy to show you the basics.
craigr
_________________
JETI 1501-HiRes 2nm Spectroradiometer
JETI 1211 Spectroradiometer
Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer
Klein K10-A Colorimeter
Murideo Fresco SIX-G HDMI 2.x Multimedia Generator
Murideo Fresco SIX-A HDMI 2.x Analyzer
Light Illusion ColourSpace XPT Color Calibration Software
Light Illusion LightSpace XPT Pro Version 10.x Color Calibration Software
OMARDRIS JVC Software Patch to use K10-A and Jeti with JVC OEM AutoCal Software!
Sencore CR7000 CRT Tube Analyzer / Rejuvenater
Authorized Dealer for Lumagen & just about everything worth buying
www.CIR-Engineering.com - craigr@cir-engineering.com
Phone: 865-405-6892
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:09 pm Post subject: |
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| macgyver655 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | Curt.. You could say your interested in promoting/ selling DVDO products if they start supporting Firmware on the VP50-VP50pro, to solve handshake problems, and old bugs.
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Have you tried the 12/2010 update for the pro? |
I always had the last updates on my DVDO.. think the pro was 1.09.. I sold it.. it was no doubt the worse DVDO i had..
The VP50, non pro just works better and makes a better image, only problem with it is that i have to play some time with it to do a handshake with my JVC X7.. IT just do amasing 422 to RGB convertion.. Makes the JVC look much better.
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CIR Engineering
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 4269
Location: Chicago USA & Berlin Germany
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| HogPilot wrote: | Totally agree - the UI on DVDO VPs is more intuitive and user friendly for the novice than on Lumagen products. And I believe that the menu system on the Vision line and the Radiance line is identical (I could be wrong on this though), so if you've seen an HDP's menus, you've seen the Radiance menus.
The only other thing that I remember being better with DVDO was their de-interlacing algorithms - the algorithms on the Gennum chip that Radiance used were't quite as robust. I believe Lumagen has made some updates to their firmware to substitute for some of the weaker Gennum algorithms, but I'll be really interested to see what VP chip they plan on using in their upcoming 4K VP. |
The menus on the Vision line are no where near as nice as the Radiance line. The Radiance menus are much improved.
Lumagen develops their own deinterlacing algorithms from scratch. They don't use features on the primary processing chip that they don't like. Early on the Radiance (and Vision) deinterlacing wasn't that hot because they hadn't gotten to it right away. Their deinterlacing has been solid on the Radiance for more than a few years now. This is why you can't compare the processing in a Lumagen to another piece of hardware with the same chip. Lumagen only uses some of the features in the primary chip's processing.
craigr
_________________
JETI 1501-HiRes 2nm Spectroradiometer
JETI 1211 Spectroradiometer
Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer
Klein K10-A Colorimeter
Murideo Fresco SIX-G HDMI 2.x Multimedia Generator
Murideo Fresco SIX-A HDMI 2.x Analyzer
Light Illusion ColourSpace XPT Color Calibration Software
Light Illusion LightSpace XPT Pro Version 10.x Color Calibration Software
OMARDRIS JVC Software Patch to use K10-A and Jeti with JVC OEM AutoCal Software!
Sencore CR7000 CRT Tube Analyzer / Rejuvenater
Authorized Dealer for Lumagen & just about everything worth buying
www.CIR-Engineering.com - craigr@cir-engineering.com
Phone: 865-405-6892
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | | macgyver655 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | Curt.. You could say your interested in promoting/ selling DVDO products if they start supporting Firmware on the VP50-VP50pro, to solve handshake problems, and old bugs.
: |
Have you tried the 12/2010 update for the pro? |
I always had the last updates on my DVDO.. think the pro was 1.09.. I sold it.. it was no doubt the worse DVDO i had..
The VP50, non pro just works better and makes a better image, only problem with it is that i have to play some time with it to do a handshake with my JVC X7.. IT just do amasing 422 to RGB convertion.. Makes the JVC look much better. |
What's your connection to the JVC?
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CIR Engineering
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 4269
Location: Chicago USA & Berlin Germany
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:13 pm Post subject: |
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Also, Jim already warned me that when the PRO comes out because it will be all new hardware that the deinterlacing will be terrible for a little while. It will take them a few months after release to improve and develope their own deinterlacing again.
craigr
_________________
JETI 1501-HiRes 2nm Spectroradiometer
JETI 1211 Spectroradiometer
Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer
Klein K10-A Colorimeter
Murideo Fresco SIX-G HDMI 2.x Multimedia Generator
Murideo Fresco SIX-A HDMI 2.x Analyzer
Light Illusion ColourSpace XPT Color Calibration Software
Light Illusion LightSpace XPT Pro Version 10.x Color Calibration Software
OMARDRIS JVC Software Patch to use K10-A and Jeti with JVC OEM AutoCal Software!
Sencore CR7000 CRT Tube Analyzer / Rejuvenater
Authorized Dealer for Lumagen & just about everything worth buying
www.CIR-Engineering.com - craigr@cir-engineering.com
Phone: 865-405-6892
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:18 pm Post subject: |
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| HogPilot wrote: | | Curt Palme wrote: | | I have to say, I have always liked the menus on the DVDO products that I've used, they are far more consumer friendly than the Lumagen ones (IMHO) (although I've never played with anything more than the HDP units), OTOH, less friendly menus make an end user less likely to go mess around in them to screw things up... |
Totally agree - the UI on DVDO VPs is more intuitive and user friendly for the novice than on Lumagen products. And I believe that the menu system on the Vision line and the Radiance line is identical (I could be wrong on this though), so if you've seen an HDP's menus, you've seen the Radiance menus.
The only other thing that I remember being better with DVDO was their de-interlacing algorithms - the algorithms on the Gennum chip that Radiance used were't quite as robust. I believe Lumagen has made some updates to their firmware to substitute for some of the weaker Gennum algorithms, but I'll be really interested to see what VP chip they plan on using in their upcoming 4K VP. |
Agree.. But as Craig say.. The Radiance just offers so much more, so it cant be compared.
I cant stand the Radiance SD deinterlacing and how it handels analog inputs, and after talking with Jim, and testing another unit i seen its just the way it is, i was sure mine was defect, so i just have other scalers to handle analog or deinterlacing.
But im also exited to see if they get the deinterlacing nailed in the new models.
I love my Radiance for what it do well, and have acepted its weakness. Im using HQV deinterlacing.
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CIR Engineering
Joined: 25 Aug 2008
Posts: 4269
Location: Chicago USA & Berlin Germany
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:32 pm Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | I cant stand the Radiance SD deinterlacing and how it handels analog inputs, and after talking with Jim, and testing another unit i seen its just the way it is, i was sure mine was defect, so i just have other scalers to handle analog or deinterlacing.
But im also exited to see if they get the deinterlacing nailed in the new models.
I love my Radiance for what it do well, and have acepted its weakness. Im using HQV deinterlacing. |
Yeah, the analog deinterlacing is not very good on the Radiance. HDMI is another story that is much better.
craigr
_________________
JETI 1501-HiRes 2nm Spectroradiometer
JETI 1211 Spectroradiometer
Photo Research PR-650 Spectroradiometer
Klein K10-A Colorimeter
Murideo Fresco SIX-G HDMI 2.x Multimedia Generator
Murideo Fresco SIX-A HDMI 2.x Analyzer
Light Illusion ColourSpace XPT Color Calibration Software
Light Illusion LightSpace XPT Pro Version 10.x Color Calibration Software
OMARDRIS JVC Software Patch to use K10-A and Jeti with JVC OEM AutoCal Software!
Sencore CR7000 CRT Tube Analyzer / Rejuvenater
Authorized Dealer for Lumagen & just about everything worth buying
www.CIR-Engineering.com - craigr@cir-engineering.com
Phone: 865-405-6892
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HogPilot
Joined: 21 Jan 2010
Posts: 2383
TV/Projector: Vizio P702ui-B3, Pioneer Elite Pro-151FD & 111FD
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:41 pm Post subject: |
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| CIR Engineering wrote: | | HogPilot wrote: | Totally agree - the UI on DVDO VPs is more intuitive and user friendly for the novice than on Lumagen products. And I believe that the menu system on the Vision line and the Radiance line is identical (I could be wrong on this though), so if you've seen an HDP's menus, you've seen the Radiance menus.
The only other thing that I remember being better with DVDO was their de-interlacing algorithms - the algorithms on the Gennum chip that Radiance used were't quite as robust. I believe Lumagen has made some updates to their firmware to substitute for some of the weaker Gennum algorithms, but I'll be really interested to see what VP chip they plan on using in their upcoming 4K VP. |
The menus on the Vision line are no where near as nice as the Radiance line. The Radiance menus are much improved.
Lumagen develops their own deinterlacing algorithms from scratch. They don't use features on the primary processing chip that they don't like. Early on the Radiance (and Vision) deinterlacing wasn't that hot because they hadn't gotten to it right away. Their deinterlacing has been solid on the Radiance for more than a few years now. This is why you can't compare the processing in a Lumagen to another piece of hardware with the same chip. Lumagen only uses some of the features in the primary chip's processing.
craigr |
Well, then I stand corrected on both those points  Thanks.
| stridsvognen wrote: | | Agree.. But as Craig say.. The Radiance just offers so much more, so it cant be compared. |
Absolutely. Everything I watch in my theater is delivered via HDMI (and about 95% of it is 1080p) so the Radiance's deinterlacing weaknesses are a moot point for me. But even so, it's light years ahead of any other consumer level VP, so I'm certainly not complaining. Every time I see new firmware with some new feature (almost always for free!), I'm amazed at how much capacity the original Radiance design was given to allow it to expand.
_________________
| ecrabb wrote: | | Curt Palme wrote: | | Interesting, Mac isn't returning my emails. Go figure. |
He's mad at us for making Hog a moderator. He took his ball and went home.
SC |
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Thu May 16, 2013 2:45 pm Post subject: |
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| CIR Engineering wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | I cant stand the Radiance SD deinterlacing and how it handels analog inputs, and after talking with Jim, and testing another unit i seen its just the way it is, i was sure mine was defect, so i just have other scalers to handle analog or deinterlacing.
But im also exited to see if they get the deinterlacing nailed in the new models.
I love my Radiance for what it do well, and have acepted its weakness. Im using HQV deinterlacing. |
Yeah, the analog deinterlacing is not very good on the Radiance. HDMI is another story that is much better.
craigr |
The analog deinterlacing sucks, SD HDMi is just bad.. lol
Dont know how HD deinterlacing looks, im sure its ok.
But DVDO ABT 102 deinterlacing adde some ringing, like some sharpness, But it never fails like the Lumagen making combing from time to time.
HQV is the best compromise i have tested yet, i just have to play a bit with sharpness and detail settings, to make them look natural /no ringing.
The Denon DVD A1XVA 480/576P out via HDMI into the Radiance makes one impressive picture.
The Vantage HD2 can do the same, but it just outputs RGB on HDMI, so.. ahh not all the same.
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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km987654
Joined: 25 Jul 2007
Posts: 2874
Location: Australia
TV/Projector: Barco BG809s
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| Posted: Fri May 17, 2013 3:47 am Post subject: |
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| stridsvognen wrote: | Lumagen is for sure 112% better support than DVDO.. They even answer our stupid questions.
And Jim is honest enough to admit the limitations of the Radiance when talking to him.. Respect. |
I don't know. I asked Lumagen for an "Advanced Remote" for my HDP Pro and even though I was paying for it the response was "Its too expensive to mail it to you". Go figure I wanted to buy this and I was happy to pay the freight but Jim (if I recall right) said he wouldn't mail it because the postage cost was too high even though I was paying for the whole deal. So even Lumagen service is capable of dumb ass stuff. 
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stridsvognen
Guest
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| Posted: Fri May 17, 2013 11:24 am Post subject: |
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| macgyver655 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | | macgyver655 wrote: | | stridsvognen wrote: | Curt.. You could say your interested in promoting/ selling DVDO products if they start supporting Firmware on the VP50-VP50pro, to solve handshake problems, and old bugs.
: |
Have you tried the 12/2010 update for the pro? |
I always had the last updates on my DVDO.. think the pro was 1.09.. I sold it.. it was no doubt the worse DVDO i had..
The VP50, non pro just works better and makes a better image, only problem with it is that i have to play some time with it to do a handshake with my JVC X7.. IT just do amasing 422 to RGB convertion.. Makes the JVC look much better. |
What's your connection to the JVC? |
HDMI..
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