CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[mattyJ]

Hi There,

I've spent quite a lot of time researching CRT projectors and reading through all of the thorough information on this site.

I've always been fascinated by CRT's and have found a lot of the digital projectors I've seen quite disappointing (the cheaper ones anyway).

I have the opportunity to purchase one of two CRT's locally. Importing from North America isn't financially feasible for me. I was hoping that some more experienced members on the forum might be able to offer an opinion or two on if either is a good investment.

Projector One

It's a Barco Graphics 1209S. It's in fully working condition but there is a blemish on the blue tube. The projector is out of town so I can't inspect it personally. See images below. Auction site start & reserve is $210 USD but auction could go as high as $670 plus I'd have to factor an additional $50+ for freight.


Projector Two

Is an older Electrohome 3500 that comes with a second 'parts' projector and also a TV View Quadscan Scaler. Hours are unknown but the owner believes the tubes are in great condition. It does have an issue with an HT lead on the blue tube 'arcing' which the owner thinks should be fixable with heat shrink. Price is approx $210 USD

My main home entertainment area is roughly 20ft long by about 16 feet wide but light control isn't the best although I watch almost exclusively later in the evening when it's fairly dark. I'm renting so installing a semi-permanent screen isn't an option but I could pin something to the wall or use a free-standing screen. I would like to upgrade from the size of my current 55" Plasma and would be aiming for at least an 80" picture but could settle for 65" + if it meant a brighter, sharper image.

My main source is my Apple TV2 and Harman Kardon Bluray system. Obviously I'll need to source a scaler that will work with these. 720p or 1080i is totally fine as most of my video isn't above these resolutions anyway.

The plan would be to have the Projector on a coffee table in the centre of the room or, behind the couches on a stand.

My main concern would be I'd buy a projector and then need to replace a tube which would be three times the price of the projector. The Barco specs wise sounds fantastic but the blemish on the blue tube sounds concerning. The Electrohome might be a bit long in the tooth but it does come with spare parts too.

My budget is really darn low. A CRT isn't a must-have but there are some good deals around.

I'd really appreciate a second opinion from someone who knows used CRT's a letter more.

Thanks,

Matt.

[Tim in Phoenix]

Hello

One cannot fix a 34,000 volt leak with heat shrink, forget the ECP, the Barco is far superior.


.

[mattyJ]

[gjaky]

[kal]

The Barco doesn't have a blemish. It's uneven tube wear that will show up as a darker square a few feet wide in the middle of the image. Probably from a Windows login prompt or similar.

Nothing wrong with wear, but it needs to be even and big. In this form it's unsuable. It affects both the green and blue tubes from your pictures.

For more info and examples of what it'll look like on screen, see: http://www.curtpalme.com/TubeCondition_OnScreen.shtm

Kal

[kal]

The Barco doesn't have a blemish. It's uneven tube wear that will show up as a darker square a few feet wide in the middle of the image. Probably from a Windows login prompt or similar.

Nothing wrong with wear, but it needs to be even and big. In this form it's unsuable. It affects both the green and blue tubes from your pictures.

For more info and examples of what it'll look like on screen, see: http://www.curtpalme.com/TubeCondition_OnScreen.shtm

Kal

[Curt Palme]

You'll definitely be annoyed with the blue, but I'll bet you can fake it with the green. Finding a decent used blue tube will be tough. If you get the set, let me know. I might be able to find you a worn blue tube that's way better than yours, but one that I can't resell for 'fairly' cheap. NEw tubes are $1500 each approx.

[Curt Palme]

You'll definitely be annoyed with the blue, but I'll bet you can fake it with the green. Finding a decent used blue tube will be tough. If you get the set, let me know. I might be able to find you a worn blue tube that's way better than yours, but one that I can't resell for 'fairly' cheap. NEw tubes are $1500 each approx.

[mattyJ]

.... That's what I was afraid of. Based on what I've read the 1209s should be really impressive but it looks like the tubes and the replacement C-elements are becoming a little hard to come by. Price-wise is it still a fair deal?

Should i definitely write off the Electrohome?

Thanks!

[gjaky]

[draganm]

[mc86]

I am likely to be a voice in the wilderness on this, but will say this: the ECP will throw a nice-enough 80" wide picture on the temporary screen you are setting up, does come with spare parts (and other parts are only cost of shipping, although getting more scarce as people trash them in the US), and are an easy first-time CRT to learn, setup and operate. I am very happy my 4500 @1080i on a 84" wide screen and have comparably little invested. The ECPs are notorious for not holding convergence and I do spend about 2mins most times I restart it doing touch-up. My wife doesn't bother normally, but sometimes just shifts blue over a pinch and is done within 10sec.

Drags is right about lucky to get $50 for a 3500 in the US, but to me, the bottom line for your crude setup in NZ, I'd offer the guy $100US for the ECP and save the other $600 for other AV equipment OR save it towards your next CRT. If you want to play HDMI sources, you'll need a HDFury or moome box or scalar of some sort, you might need cables, maybe a better amp, etc.

bottom line: reflect on what you want now and what you want to pay...don't just go for the best performing projector now. My opinion.

Bests!
Matt

[ecrabb]

[RaWsHaRk]

dont touch the EH, even in here they are giving working ones away and nobody wants them. the barco is great machine, the picture will be far superior even with that tube.

[mattyJ]

Just an update,

Quite keen to pull the trigger on the 1209s where the owner says he's just had it up and running and that all tubes are working perfectly.

Another couple of options have come along possibly worth considering though.

There's a very tidy example of a Barco Cine 6 for sale. This is the only CRT PJ that my partner has seen and actually doesn't mind the look of. No fans and a smaller size would be helpful since it will be in our living room and not a dedicated theater. The 800x600 (possibly 1080i?) res is a bit concerning though. I'd like to accomplish at least 1080i without driving the PJ too hard. Only has approx 3300hrs use on it. Two owners since new.

The other one is a Barco Vision 701s. I'm not totally sure of the condition but owner seems to think it's in great condition. Seams like a good step up from the Cine 6 with the higher res but it's still a 7" PJ.

The Cine 6 is just over twice the price of the 1209s but it looks in excellent condition and I could view it in person. The 701s is also viewable in person.

The 1209s specs wise is an absolute beast and would surely run circles around the others. I just don't want to have a huge, loud dinosaur that needs a $1000 lamp replaced soon? Also, freighting it the 300 miles to my place I fear that it could damage easily?

Thoughts....?

[jbmeyer13]

If this is the same 1209s from the photo above, the owner has a very different definition of "all tubes working perfectly" than the rest of us. There is uneven wear on the blue and green tubes from the photo above and it needs to be replaced in order to provide a decent image. As is, the unit will not provide an image you will be happy with and it will sit around collecting dust until you can afford to buy 2 decent used tubes.

I can't speak for the CRT market in New Zealand but the vast majority of PJ's with 8" tubes (in good condition) are going for<$750. I would keep searching for an 8" or 9" PJ in better condition. I wouldn't waste your time with a 7" PJ.

[mattyJ]

What's the likelihood of finding and replacing the blue and green tubes in the 1209? CRT's are a little hard to come buy in the 9" variety. 7" ones pop up every now and then though.

[mxer]

Try a reverse burn to even out the burned image before buying a newish tube.

[kal]

[kal]

[hansilili]

Sorry, but what am I missing here. You are not yet addicted by CRT just for the sake of it (like most the rest of us), you want to light up a living room, you have to consider WAF, used projector offers are quite rare where you live and market prices are double as in the rest of the world, all available machines have major draw backs, you are willing to spend $ 500 - 1500. The only thing that speaks pro CRT is that you have not yet mentioned to be afraid of deadly electronics and endless nights of convergence adjustment.

You are a perfect fit for a used JVC HD1 (shipped from overseas in necessary) or somthing like that.

cheers
hansilili

[mattyJ]

You're quite right. I suppose I've always been interested in having yesterday's high-end equipment as opposed to today's entry level. My car stereo is all top of the line Alpine gear circa 1998. Yes it took a lot of hacking/tweaking but the results and reliability have been well worth it.

I haven't looked into LCD/DLP to any great depth in the last 5 years but the general consensus I found online was that they're still not quite there with PQ until you start spending $2000+ and the need to frequently purchase new bulbs would annoy me a bit. The LCD projectors I've seen to date weren't all that inspiring.

I'll happily accept that a CRT needs tweaking on a regular basis and will have it's drawbacks. My goal really is a an image of 65" - 100" that is as good or better than my LG 50" Plasma. 1080i or 720p would be ideal but I'd even accept lower res if the picture quality is excellent. Most of my source material is only SD or 720p max.

I saw an opportunity with that 1209s but after marking it out on the floor it's a bit massive for my living room. I'll keep my eye out and go see some of the cheaper/smaller CRT's on offer and if I can get my feet wet for under $200 USD then it's a pretty low risk endeavor.

I will start with purchasing the CRT DVD and see what I'm really in for.

Cheers,

[gjaky]

Then keep an eye on NEC projectors (anything newer than PG plain would do fine), they have the best size/performance ratio amongst all CRT.