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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:15 am Post subject: Wood Glue for cleaning super dirty LP Records!!! |
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I was looking up ino for my M95HE Shure cartridge and while browsing the Audiokarma forums I came across this thread.
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showthread.php?t=99837
An updated method with audio sound files and visual sound wave captures are on this link. I think I might give it a try
on some super beat up records I have.
http://www.audiokarma.org/forums/showpost.php?p=2992798&postcount=507
I decided to cut and paste the post images here from the first post in the thread.
| mopic5 wrote: | After hearing the boys over in Europe chat this one up, I decided to give it a go. It’s a bit “fiddly” as they say over there and it does takes a bit of practice, but even my first attempt on a not-so-loved ancient and filthy specimen, produced a dramatic, near elimination of surface noise. Better than the proVPI clean that I’ve been paying $1.50 a pop to have done.
This is the “Before” shot AFTER I spent nearly two minutes cleaning it with my non-aggressive Audioquest brush. To prep the record for the wood glue, I used 4 small pieces of vinyl (First-aid) tape and placed them halfway into the run-in space of the record at the 4 compass points. This is to help peel back the dried glue film.
The premise in all this is that plastic vinyl is very resistant to glue adhesion. Wood glue being predominantly made up of polyvinyl acrylate and is a close cousin to polyvinyl chloride (LPs) so they get on well together without any plasticising transfers – at least, for the short run. When they do come apart, gobs of junk caught in the grooves throughout the ages lifts off with the glue.
This was my first attempt. A little too much – probably about 40-45 grams of glue when 30 grams probably would have done the job. Too little – and it’ll be the devil trying to get it off in big pieces – the ideal being to get the film to peel back in one big piece. Too much – you risk having trapped pockets of undried glue. I used an old credit card to spread the glue on an old churning Rek-O-Kut. If you make it just a bit thicker toward the lip, this will help to give purchase for lift off. Normally this should take about 4-5 hours to dry (1/2 hour after it becomes transparent). Mine took about 8 hours.
Not one piece, but about four – not too bad though. I’ll try some tape on the run-out space next time.
 [img]
Through this “death mask” impression, the grooves modulations are easy to see. While there is some dirt pictured here, a lot of the big stuff is small imperfections on the vinyl that were magnified by bubbling as the glue dried.
Seeing, is not always believing. But hearing is. Snap, Crackle and Pop have left the building.
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I thought it was cool idea to share here with the boys. Any of you ever try this? Drags? Chris?
Athanasios
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Last edited by Nashou66 on Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:44 am; edited 1 time in total
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AnalogRocks
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Joined: 08 Mar 2006
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Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 2:30 am Post subject: |
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Cool! Beats the cleaning method I use to use.
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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ChrisWiggles
Opinionated SOB
Joined: 12 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 8:22 pm Post subject: |
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I have never tried such a thing. I'm horrified, and while I'm not a chemist, this seems like it's rife for problems. I also absolutely would want to thoroughly washed after doing this.
So I really don't see the point, since a good wet-wash should accomplish the same thing, and do a much much better job of getting deep into the groove. I can't imagine how the wood glue would do anything but pick up stuff off the surface of the record.
It also looks like it'd be a royal PITA and take a long time if you had to do this for many records at all.
But I dunno, I'd like to hear the difference myself. I'm willing to give it a chance.
I'm occupied at the moment, but I'll check out the thread and examples later. While it seems like a totally wacky idea, then again it might be brilliant.
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garyfritz
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
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Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Thu Feb 10, 2011 9:07 pm Post subject: |
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Yeah, I was thinking a good wet-wash ought to do the job too.
If you were going to use glue, I would think something stretchy/flexible like rubber cement would be better. But maybe it interacts more with the vinyl than wood glue does.
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Nashou66
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WanMan
Joined: 19 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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The concern isn't the cleaning ability, but the long-term chemical interaction that could mellow the record's carvings.
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
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Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 1:20 pm Post subject: |
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| WanMan wrote: | | The concern isn't the cleaning ability, but the long-term chemical interaction that could mellow the record's carvings. |
If you read the thread thats the beauty of this, the Wood glue chemicals do not interact with the Vinyl. Now on a lacquer 78 or a 45 single is a different story.
Plus hopefully it be a one time cleaning for those records that are beyond the cleaning of a wet cleaner. And no scrubbing or abrasions to the groves like those wet scrubbing cleaners do.
Athanasios
_________________
Don't blame your underwear for your crooked ass~ unknown Greek philosopher
"Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the Democrats believe every day is April 15." --- President Reagan
One Smart Dog!!!
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 2:29 pm Post subject: |
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Darin over at AVS has used a spray on cleaner for lenses. Once it is cured, you peel it off. Maybe this could do the same thing with less hassle.
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mc86
Joined: 20 Sep 2008
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Location: pittsburgh, pa
TV/Projector: ECP 4500 (Vidikron box), ECP4500+, wanting 07MS/07MTS, evaluating pc soft-blend
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 3:13 pm Post subject: |
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Wow...however am I mistaken in think that those waveforms may or may not be a little misleading visually as x-axis doesn't cover the same domain? That is, I see the uncleaned are 2-30 time/sample-units and the cleaned are 5-80 time/sample units.
Matt
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Nashou66
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Phil Smith
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 6:04 pm Post subject: |
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That seems like a great idea to me. 
| Spanky Ham wrote: | | Darin over at AVS has used a spray on cleaner for lenses. Once it is cured, you peel it off. Maybe this could do the same thing with less hassle. |
Eric, you have any idea what Darin is using? I'd like to have some of that for cleaning camera lenses.
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Tom.W
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:27 pm Post subject: |
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| Phil Smith wrote: | That seems like a great idea to me.
| Spanky Ham wrote: | | Darin over at AVS has used a spray on cleaner for lenses. Once it is cured, you peel it off. Maybe this could do the same thing with less hassle. |
Eric, you have any idea what Darin is using? I'd like to have some of that for cleaning camera lenses. |
Sounds a bit risky to me ! 
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MikeEby
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 10:42 pm Post subject: |
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I tried it on my CD's and couldn't tell a difference.
Mike
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ChrisWiggles
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| Posted: Fri Feb 11, 2011 11:08 pm Post subject: |
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| Tom.W wrote: | | Phil Smith wrote: | That seems like a great idea to me.
| Spanky Ham wrote: | | Darin over at AVS has used a spray on cleaner for lenses. Once it is cured, you peel it off. Maybe this could do the same thing with less hassle. |
Eric, you have any idea what Darin is using? I'd like to have some of that for cleaning camera lenses. |
Sounds a bit risky to me ! |
I think it would really depend on lens coatings and stuff like that. That's a major concern is if you lifted off the various things they often coat lenses with.
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Nashou66
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Tom.W
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Spanky Ham
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 3:28 am Post subject: |
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| Phil Smith wrote: | That seems like a great idea to me.
| Spanky Ham wrote: | | Darin over at AVS has used a spray on cleaner for lenses. Once it is cured, you peel it off. Maybe this could do the same thing with less hassle. |
Eric, you have any idea what Darin is using? I'd like to have some of that for cleaning camera lenses. |
I will have to look it up.
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Phil Smith
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:07 pm Post subject: |
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Tom I have a lens cleaning phobia. I literally won't clean them for fear of scratching them. A peel off cleaner that doesn't require me to rub on the lens is an appealing option.
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garyfritz
Joined: 08 Apr 2006
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Location: Fort Collins, CO
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| Posted: Sat Feb 12, 2011 8:11 pm Post subject: |
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Phil, I've gotten good results by spraying a decent lens cleaner on the lens to flush off any dust, then spray with deionized water. Then I very carefully dry it with a 100% cotton tissue.
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