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dvh99
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 2158
Location: nederland
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| Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:53 pm Post subject: |
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ok that should take care of the criticism, pics are great as always but get that freaking bow out of the picture, geez.
_________________
1 answer always poses multiple questions.
marquee 9500ultra HD10L moome hdmi1.3 v3+ some mods.
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 10:57 pm Post subject: |
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| dvh99 wrote: | | ok that should take care of the criticism, pics are great as always but get that freaking bow out of the picture, geez. |
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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macgyver655
Joined: 22 Aug 2007
Posts: 8508
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| Posted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 1:44 am Post subject: |
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I dont think anyone said that Mike.
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Spanky Ham
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 5643
Location: Comedy Central
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:30 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: | | Spanky Ham wrote: |
I would think you need to delve into the MTF tests and try to understand them. It really isn't that difficult
And it's not that important to me either. If it were, it would have been on my to do list of things to test and verify what I'm doing.
Continuing to show screenshots for proof of sharpness and improvements without any meaningful reliable and repeatable tests is almost pointless. |
Let me help you out here. Concerning "sharpness" that would depend on the bandwidth and focusing ability of the set. using the SMPTE pattern, I've 100% proven that both Bandwidth and focusing ability is right were it needs to be concerning SHARPNESS with that SMPTE TEST pattern
Now for improvements... The MTF test does nothing to confirm performance improvements. To prove my point, a cheap digital projector would almost out perform any CRT with the MTF test, but we know that a cheap or otherwise Digital projector would not necessarily out perform a CRT projector in performance improvements.
Simply because I've been able to prove things with the SMPTE pattern, which is A VERY MEANINGFUL and RELIABLE test, it's really a pointless remark. So I'm not sure what you're tying to get me to prove, because there's really no need for me to prove anything beyond what I've already proven.
Showing a screenshot of the SMPTE pattern properly resolving 1080P 72hz with all three colors on at the same time is considered a pointless and non meaningful test.. |
I debated on whether to reply to this or not, but I thought I would. I kind of figured you would take this attitude based on your back and forth with Mac.
Honestly, I don't care if you take the MTF measurements or not, as I am not buying your mods. Yes, a digital will blow away a CRT in MTF, but that isn't the point. The point was to see what kind of improvement you are actually achieving with each upgrade.
As for the legitimacy of MTF, I believe Scott has told me that the industry has always used that as an important measurement
| mp20748 wrote: |
likewise, any CRT projector that can properly display 1080P 72hz with all three colors on using the SMPTE pattern would without a doubt exceed the other CRT projectors, because I don't know of a stock CRT projector that can either do 1080P @ 72hz with all three colors on, or one that can resolve that bandwidth without premature blooming.
So with that said, why would a potential buyer get pissed about a bunch of numbers that has nothing to do with ACTUAL performance that exceeds anything out there that I know of.
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That is interesting. So you are saying that your performance exceeds the pjs coming off the line at VDC? If that is the case, then why are you wasting your time selling your mods to this market when you could make much more selling to the simulation industry.
I am not going to debate this, as I was just trying to see what kind of performance delta you have achieved over your last version. Good luck with your mod sales.
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dvh99
Joined: 25 Dec 2009
Posts: 2158
Location: nederland
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 10:53 pm Post subject: |
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the reason scott posted is to tell us that when making modifications the mtf is a nice feature to measure actual improvements, when measured under equal conditions of course (screen ambient light contrast and brightness setting and scan freq) and taken with the same camera and maybe even same zoom.
the number of mtf an sich is absolutely pointless.
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 2:41 am Post subject: |
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| Spanky Ham wrote: |
As for the legitimacy of MTF, I believe Scott has told me that the industry has always used that as an important measurement |
OK, what industry, CRT projector and what camera did they use?
| Quote: |
That is interesting. So you are saying that your performance exceeds the pjs coming off the line at VDC? If that is the case, then why are you wasting your time selling your mods to this market when you could make much more selling to the simulation industry |
A very large percentage of the simulation industry has gone digital already. It remained CRT for a long time only because of the limitation of the vertical refresh rate at the time. The exceptions in the industry is the cost to upgrade. If the cost was not an issue, the entire simulation industry would be digital.
The commercial video industry has never been as critical on image quality as it is in the HT market. The two industries are very different. Even the 100K plus digitals are sub standard in image quality compared even to something under $4K in the HT market today.
Both Scott and I have discussed this several times. The manufacturers of these CRT projectors were not so concerned about the same things the HT market is concerned with. Scott himself told me in our last conversation the goal was to get it working and out the door.
They did their part, I only took it from there..
| Quote: | | I am not going to debate this, as I was just trying to see what kind of performance delta you have achieved over your last version. Good luck with your mod sales. |
The MTF test would not be an accurate indicator for PERFORMANCE in what I've been doing. A $100.00 digital projector purchased on Ebay would mop the floor with any CRT projector using that MTF test. Now take that same digital, put it right next to my 9500LC and watch what happens.
It's funny that you would want to see my latest changes confirmed using that test. I've received a many comment from quite a few people indicating how much the changes are showing up even in the screenshots since the latest changes.
Concerning selling them. Well, no need for me to worry about that, considering I've had a few offers to take them off my hands..
btw, Are we no longer using the SMPTE test as a means of determining anything?
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JOneil
Joined: 05 Jul 2010
Posts: 47
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| Posted: Thu Sep 09, 2010 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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| mp20748 wrote: |
Concerning selling them. Well, no need for me to worry about that, considering I've had a few offers to take them off my hands..
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Yeah, those Marquee owners are looking for anything they can to get a better picture. 
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