CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

stefuel · Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 12:21 pm Post subject:

Mike,
I have no interest in this one way or the other but you seem to be spending more time side-stepping the request asked then it would take you to actually do the test. If you continue to refuse the test, people will start to doubt your claims.
Even if the test provides no usefull results, I think it would be in your best interest to satisfy the request. I'm not trying to start a arguement here, just making a observation. Do as you will. DONE...

mp20748 · Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 6:36 pm Post subject:

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

stefuel · Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 8:52 pm Post subject:

"I have no interest what-so-ever in doing that test. For as long as HIGH END CRT's have been in existence. I can't ever recall the MTF test being used or required in the SPECs."

Since when has this forum ever relied on "SPECS"? If so, we would all be doing 1080I and be happy with it. I don't care if you are the messiah of all things electronic or that this test may be a total waste of time. The fact is, you've been asked to provide the results of a simple test and you refuse. Prospective customers do not like this kind of attitude. Those Marquee owners that are "on the fence" about buying your mods are now having second thoughts about getting them and those that have are second guessing their decision. Even if the test has no real world value, unless you're hiding something, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. Like I said, I don't have a Marquee and as such have zero interest in this discussion. However, if you continue down this path, I vision interest in all your hard work going down the toilet.
It's your choice, choose wisely. As the true grail will provide everlasting life, the false grail will provide instant death.
I saw that in a movie. It wasn't 1080P72 though Wink

This is my last post on this subject as I get no enjoyment involving myself with this. I have bigger fish to fry. Wink

mp20748 · Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 9:03 pm Post subject:

dvh99 · Joined: 25 Dec 2009 Posts: 2158 Location: nederland

now that i think of it, the mtf test is also helpful for the water vs glycol debate.

stefuel · Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 11:06 pm Post subject:

"Again, If I'm the only one with these mods in my projector, I'm cool with that.."

If you piss offf enough perspective buyers, that's exactly the way it will be.

BTW, what's the MTF of your Ampro?

I don't care what it is. I'm not selling it or promoting anything. That said, if I was to use the pictures posted as a example, I would estimate mine running at 1080P60 in a 1.78:1 aspect ratio at about 25-30%. And that might even be high. I'll even go one step more and tell you that my 3600HD does it better than my 4600HD.(ON SCREEN) I attribute that to diffusion within the liquid coupling. I think if you were to match pattern sizes on screen, a A/C will win that test every time.

Now this time I really am done.

mp20748 · Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 11:32 pm Post subject:

[quote="stefuel"]"Again, If I'm the only one with these mods in my projector, I'm cool with that.."

If you piss offf enough perspective buyers, that's exactly the way it will be.

LOL................ Mr. Green

Piss them off by not supplying the MTF measurement??

One thing we know for sure without any MTF measurement, and that is that any CRT projector that can properly display that SMPTE pattern with all three colors on at 1080P 72HZ, would without a doubt have a higher than normal MTF performance.

likewise, any CRT projector that can properly display 1080P 72hz with all three colors on using the SMPTE pattern would without a doubt exceed the other CRT projectors, because I don't know of a stock CRT projector that can either do 1080P @ 72hz with all three colors on, or one that can resolve that bandwidth without premature blooming.

So with that said, why would a potential buyer get pissed about a bunch of numbers that has nothing to do with ACTUAL performance that exceeds anything out there that I know of.

If a potential buyer wants MTF numbers than they don't want these mods, because I'll not be providing any. If a potential buyer wants performance, and performance that has been proven to exceed any stock CRT projector that I know of, then they could be interested in the mods.

I'm offering performance mods period.

Dictionary Definition of PERFORMANCE
1
a : the execution of an action

b : something accomplished : deed, feat

kschmit2 · Posted: Mon Aug 30, 2010 7:28 am Post subject:

Nashou66 · Joined: 12 Jan 2007 Posts: 16171 Location: West Seneca NY

tse · Joined: 03 May 2006 Posts: 1014 Location: Sweatbucket, Fl.

http://www.edmundoptics.com/onlinecatalog/displayproduct.cfm?productID=1831

Is cheaper. The 5, 10, and maybe 20 lp/mm ones might be useful.

Scott

dvh99 · Joined: 25 Dec 2009 Posts: 2158 Location: nederland

if the pt22 tube uses the same gun aperture as the lug why doesnt the marquee have any problems with focussing them.
my pt22 is even sharper then my red lcp and doesnt bloom at contrast level 75.

mp20748 · Posted: Tue Aug 31, 2010 8:50 pm Post subject:

Craig did make it out to install the boards into his clients Marquee on Monday.

I spoke with him yesterday and today, but would rather he posted his observations.

The only thing I can share on this is that the same exact set of boards (VIM, neck boards) that were in my Marquee at the time when Craig was here, is the same set that was installed in his clients Marquee.

So among a few other things reported, that set of boards did not get the same results that we got here. He did not observe no blooming at higher contrast with this set of modified boards. His client has both LUG and stock CRT's in use.

We'll be looking at duplicating as much as possible what i have in my setup. And Craig reminded me that when he was here I was running contrast upto 100 with the stock focus coils.

stefuel · Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 12:26 am Post subject:

Should I..................should I.........................Naaaaaaa.

mp20748 · Posted: Wed Sep 01, 2010 1:40 am Post subject:

mp20748 · Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:48 pm Post subject:

I wanted to get back o this after checking some things out the other night. I was also hoping that Craig would have posted on his observations from his clients visit.

Since this thread is about LUG's and Marquees, I'll try and stay to that.

The issue of LUG's prematurely blooming in a Marquee, I'm not familiar with. And since my mods came up in this thread being able to maintain a contrast up to 100 without blooming, I'll like to be clear on that and what I found out since hearing from Craig and from what I've experienced on my and a one other CRT owners Marquee.

In the conversation with Craig at his Clients the other day, he indicated that his client also had stock tubes in his projector. I had forgot about that, and now being clear on that I got a chance to llok at this problem with stock tubes on my test bed 8500LC.

So far, what i was not clear about that goes on with my set I'm now 100% clear about why my set with do 100 contrast they way it does. before i had mentioned it being noise in/on the video chain. that is about 80% true. the other 20% has a lot to do with the HVPS supplying EXACTLY 34.9 volts to the anode of the tubes. The filament voltage also has to be exact (6.3).

The other thing that I've also mentioned earlier in this thread was that I was doing what Sony does on the G2 of the G90. Sony has a inductor in series on the G90's G2 feed to the tubes. I too have that same value inductor in place.

I will be looking at this more closer later as I get time, and based on what I found the other day, I should be able to make this (increased contrast before bloom) happen on LUGs and stock CRT's.

It'll not be something I'll want to get into offering, just be able to make it happen and show what and how i did it. It's clearly very obvious on my 9500LC, so I should be able to duplicate that as well.

I'd rather still stay away from any claims or promises that my mods can make these results happen.

I'll get back later when i can do more research into this. I'll also be getting Galen involved. he will be doing most of the testing.

CIR Engineering · Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:48 pm Post subject:

So I installed Mike's VNB's and VIM in my client's projector this Monday. I also did Mike's convergence board ground mod and another mod that Mike told me about that he doesn't want to get into yet.

Long story short, the upgrades did not reduce the blooming at high contrast on my client's projector at all. His projector still blooms at exactly the same point.

He has a green LUG between a red and blue LCP.

Mike's mods did however DRAMATICALLY improve the BW of the projector and really cleaned up the image a TON. Before the VIM and VNB's this Madrigal was really attenuating 1080p 60Hz and 72Hz. After the upgrades the projector is doing a very solid 1080p with very little attenuation. At the center of the screen, this Madrigal now can match the G90 in sharpness.

I will go back out to the client as soon as I feel like it to make the adjustments to the HVPS (I hadn't brought my HV probe) and to try Mike's G2 inductor mod. I will also try anything else Mike suggests.

craigr.

CIR Engineering · Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 1:53 pm Post subject:

Oh yeah, Mike's mods also did not change the beam current in any meaningful way (although this is a moot point since the focus/contrast did not change). The mods did increase (raise) the black level, but after re-calibration the projector put out the same white flt as before the mods.

craigr

mp20748 · Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 4:53 pm Post subject:

mp20748 · Posted: Thu Sep 02, 2010 5:37 pm Post subject:

Also took these last night. They were also taking with the Sony camera, which appears a lot darker than the Fuji.

I'll look more at it later, but I'm thinking I'll either need to raise the contrast or do something to the camera

Still a robust and full 1080P 72HZ

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