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Blorton
Joined: 27 Jan 2009
Posts: 105
Location: Hotlanta, GA
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| Posted: Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:02 pm Post subject: Upgrading an 8500LC to 9500LC - what's needed? |
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Anyone have a reference on this they can share? I'll be wanting to replace the green tube anyway and figured I'd see what going into the 9"er's would entail. Besides the tubes, and possibly the lenses, I need to replace the neck boards also, right? Are most of the boards okay at least for starters?
Ultimately I want to end up with the Ultra setup and maxed bandwidth but would like to do the upgrade process in stages if possible.
I should probably mention I've had formal electronics training and am no slouch with an iron, but I'm not equipped for SMD work. (That was a lot of years ago and I do very different work for a living.  ) One of these days I'll get around to buying a scope...
Thanks,
Dan
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Tim in Phoenix
Joined: 21 Oct 2006
Posts: 4409
Location: Phoenix
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| Posted: Sat Mar 14, 2009 6:25 pm Post subject: |
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Say Dan
You would need nine inch tubes mounted in nine inch LC castings, and the plastic tube covers, as the eight inch LC tube covers are not long enough. Your existing
yokes and neckboards can be used on nine inch tubes. A small mod to neckboards is needed if you select LUGs.
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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Elaine Benes
Joined: 25 Apr 2006
Posts: 1416
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| Posted: Sun Mar 15, 2009 12:13 pm Post subject: |
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| Nashou66 wrote: | Or if your up to it you can can do a bit more mod work to the neck board and use Thomas Tubes wit the sony pin outs, I have a whole stock pile of those .
Tim has the 9 Inch housings form burt out tube's. you would need them to swap new tubes into them.
Athanasios |
Are you using any Thomas tubes yet ?
What kind of light output are you getting ? Focus quality ?
How much are they ? Can they be used in an AC machine just as well ? What about a Barco pinout, is that the same as the Sony pinout ?
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1031
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 657
Location: Finland
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:13 pm Post subject: |
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| 1031 wrote: | | Elaine Benes wrote: |
Are you using any Thomas tubes yet ?
What kind of light output are you getting ? Focus quality ?
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I have those 9" thomas tubes on my marquee. But iīm wrong person to say anything about how those compaire with Panasonic tubeīs because this is my first 9"lc project. But i had eye one at loan for a while and got some "data"
http://www.dvdplaza.fi/galleria/showphoto.php/photo/17908/ppuser/6701
Primaries lookīs good ( colored c-elements at R&G)
I had that calibration done at 1080i@72hz and got about 8-9 FL before blooming, with progressive resolution litte more.
Hard to say how those focus but even with crappy hd-10īs (from old barco) those project nice picture compaired to my setup before (8500 with hd-145) Light output is little better and contrast way better than before. |
Ben is using them also longer that we have.
Once I get the Bellows made i am going to do a full set and convert my one 8500 to a 9500LC.
Athanasios
_________________
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"Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the Democrats believe every day is April 15." --- President Reagan
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Last edited by Nashou66 on Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:47 pm; edited 1 time in total
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CRT_Ben
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 1684
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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As Nash says I'm using the Thomas tubes - I started using them in Fall 2007.
I find that I cannot get very good focus with the tubes above say contrast 40 - and it's better if I go lower - however at 40 contrast I can still resolve a 1 on/1 off 1080p pattern decently. BUT I'm not sure the blooming is the tubes' fault - I bought a set of spare neck boards to modify for the Thomas tubes and I DIDN'T test them before I modded them (stupid I know). So the neckboards could be soft, I just don't know. I haven't gotten around to trying to swap any parts on the neckboards because I moved in January, the theater needs to be drywalled, and I scored a minty set of P19LCP's so I probably won't be using the Thomas tubes anymore. Nashou, maybe some day we can do a neckboard swap by mail and I can see if it's my neckboards that are the problem.
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Nashou66
Joined: 12 Jan 2007
Posts: 16171
Location: West Seneca NY
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| Posted: Wed Mar 18, 2009 2:05 pm Post subject: |
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| CRT_Ben wrote: | As Nash says I'm using the Thomas tubes - I started using them in Fall 2007.
I find that I cannot get very good focus with the tubes above say contrast 40 - and it's better if I go lower - however at 40 contrast I can still resolve a 1 on/1 off 1080p pattern decently. BUT I'm not sure the blooming is the tubes' fault - I bought a set of spare neck boards to modify for the Thomas tubes and I DIDN'T test them before I modded them (stupid I know). So the neckboards could be soft, I just don't know. I haven't gotten around to trying to swap any parts on the neckboards because I moved in January, the theater needs to be drywalled, and I scored a minty set of P19LCP's so I probably won't be using the Thomas tubes anymore. Nashou, maybe some day we can do a neckboard swap by mail and I can see if it's my neckboards that are the problem. |
Sure, I can send you a neck board and you can compare it to one of yours.
I know Afeg , who sold me the tubes did the mods and he said he sees no difference between the LUG's and the thomas, they actually used both tubes mixed in the PJ that they were designed for. that PJ Neck board had jumpers on it that you could swap around for the different tubes being used. He is using a mega ohm resistor for the arc suppression, not sure if that could affect focus or not.
Athanasios
_________________
Don't blame your underwear for your crooked ass~ unknown Greek philosopher
"Republicans believe every day is the Fourth of July, but the Democrats believe every day is April 15." --- President Reagan
One Smart Dog!!!
Marquee High Performance Bellows now shipping!!
Marquee Modifications and Performance Enhancement
Marquee C-element and Bellow removal
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1031
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 657
Location: Finland
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 8:16 am Post subject: |
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| CRT_Ben wrote: | As Nash says I'm using the Thomas tubes - I started using them in Fall 2007.
I find that I cannot get very good focus with the tubes above say contrast 40 - and it's better if I go lower - however at 40 contrast I can still resolve a 1 on/1 off 1080p pattern decently. BUT I'm not sure the blooming is the tubes' fault - I bought a set of spare neck boards to modify for the Thomas tubes and I DIDN'T test them before I modded them (stupid I know). So the neckboards could be soft, I just don't know. I haven't gotten around to trying to swap any parts on the neckboards because I moved in January, the theater needs to be drywalled, and I scored a minty set of P19LCP's so I probably won't be using the Thomas tubes anymore. Nashou, maybe some day we can do a neckboard swap by mail and I can see if it's my neckboards that are the problem. |
Ben, you you remember what was value for that spark suppressor resistor what you used? I have 560Kohmīs there. Maybe those have something to do there. I remember that barco 1200 uses sony tubes (with same pin out as Thomas tubes) and those had 15Kv voltage feedet to that same pin (and that pin was labeled as focus) but still those were focused by focus yoke. Maybe i must try with 1Mohm and see if there is difference..
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CRT_Ben
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 1684
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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| 1031 wrote: | | Ben, you you remember what was value for that spark suppressor resistor what you used? I have 560Kohmīs there. Maybe those have something to do there. I remember that barco 1200 uses sony tubes (with same pin out as Thomas tubes) and those had 15Kv voltage feedet to that same pin (and that pin was labeled as focus) but still those were focused by focus yoke. Maybe i must try with 1Mohm and see if there is difference.. |
So you are running these tubes also? Are you having focus issues or are you getting good performance out of them?
Below is what tse sent me, based on that I think I'm using a 1M resistor.
"The KH pin is connected to spark gnd through a 1 Meg resistor, the Arc Sup pin is connected directly to spark gnd. Spark ground is the metal plate that the two braid cables coming from the front of the Marquee tubes are connected to." -tse
Ben
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1031
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 657
Location: Finland
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 2:54 pm Post subject: |
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| CRT_Ben wrote: |
So you are running these tubes also? Are you having focus issues or are you getting good performance out of them?
Below is what tse sent me, based on that I think I'm using a 1M resistor.
"The KH pin is connected to spark gnd through a 1 Meg resistor, the Arc Sup pin is connected directly to spark gnd. Spark ground is the metal plate that the two braid cables coming from the front of the Marquee tubes are connected to." -tse
Ben |
Not sure if there is focus issues, havent ever seen how panasonic tubeīs focus.. Blooming is more what iīm trying to solve. So you have one 1Mohm resistor from arc supp. pin to "spark gnd" i have 560Kohm there, Tse says that 1M is from KH pin to gnd (LUG tubeīs has that pin) Thomas tubes has not that KH pin, maybe i should trye put that arc supp. pin direct to gnd then.
-Jarmo
_________________
Marquee 9500LC (Frankenyokes / Thomas electric tubes / HD-10L / +many modīs)
DVDO VP-50
New hobby, Rally
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX2Rtpr1njs
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ZP9FEFXV5c
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j065vei6j6s
http://www.facebook.com/pages/JTS-Racing-team/204443719572685
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1031
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 657
Location: Finland
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 4:20 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | Blooming is more what iīm trying to solve.
-Jarmo |
What is the anode voltage requirement for the Thomas tubes, is it the same as your projector (34.9KV)??
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1031
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 657
Location: Finland
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:00 pm Post subject: |
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| 1031 wrote: | | Hello Mike. Datasheet says: 40Kv (max) and testreport says that they use 34Kv during "test run" Hmm, i have HVPS from M8000, maybe i test if that 900volt difference has something to do with blooming. |
Forget what their test report says. A 40KV tube is not going to function properly @ 34.9KV, and that explains the problems you guys are reporting here.
Think about this, what happens if you had original Panasonic tubes in a Marquee with a 34.9KV HVPS, and you removed that HVPS and put in one from an earlier 8000/9000 34KV HVPS?
I'll help you out... You should notice a slight blooming when increasing the contrast and some weakness in brightness with the 34KV HVPS. But don't forget, we're only talking about a 9KV difference here.
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1031
Joined: 22 Mar 2006
Posts: 657
Location: Finland
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CRT_Ben
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 1684
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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Wasn't there an early 1993-1994 timeframe 9000 that ran on 40kV?
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mp20748
Joined: 12 Sep 2006
Posts: 5689
Location: Maryland
TV/Projector: 9500LC Ultra / Super 02 and 03 VIM
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:16 pm Post subject: |
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| CRT_Ben wrote: | | Wasn't there an early 1993-1994 timeframe 9000 that ran on 40kV? |
40KV is supposed to be an option on all the Marquee HVPS.. Check out JP2 in the shot below:
Inside view of Marquee HVPS.
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CRT_Ben
Joined: 28 Aug 2006
Posts: 1684
Location: Northern Virginia
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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Anybody with the balls to change that jumper? Not sure if I want to fry my parts machine and/or Thomas tubes...
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nuttall_chris
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 832
Location: Ottawa, Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Thu Mar 19, 2009 6:32 pm Post subject: |
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| CRT_Ben wrote: |
Anybody with the balls to change that jumper? Not sure if I want to fry my parts machine and/or Thomas tubes... |
I have no problem changing the jumper...it's plugging in the projector and turning it on that's the scary part 
Chris.
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