CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

I looked on ebay for an HDTV tuner for my BG1208. I thought i might find one of those old converters with RGBHV out from the era of "HD Ready" TV's. No luck. I found a lot of dvd combo tuners, but it was not even clear if they were true tuners or just converters with 1080 upscale. I found one of those VGA out, made-in-china specials, but i'm not sure if i want to go that route yet.
Any Ideas?

MikeEby · Joined: 24 Jun 2007 Posts: 5237 Location: Osceola, Indiana

An Old DTC100 should work and has RGBHV out. It also has a Direct TV receiver but will work standalone. I used one on my old Barco 800 running 1080i.

http://cgi.ebay.com/RCA-HDTV-DirecTV-Satellite-Receiver-DTC100-FREE-SHIP_W0QQitemZ380108707637QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item380108707637&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1729%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A0%7C293%3A2%7C294%3A50

http://cgi.ebay.com/RCA-DTC100-HDTV-DTV-SATELLITE-RECEIVER_W0QQitemZ220375371838QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_DefaultDomain_0?hash=item220375371838&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14&_trkparms=72%3A1729%7C66%3A2%7C65%3A12%7C39%3A1%7C240%3A1318%7C301%3A1%7C293%3A1%7C294%3A50

Mike

ecrabb · Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 1:15 am Post subject:

A samsung sir-ts360 is one of the best VGA-out atsc OTA tuners. They're cheap, too.

SC

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

Thanks guys, just put a couple of both on my watch list. so do these babies have optical tsolink out as well?

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 2:24 am Post subject:

The Samsung has optical out but be aware if they don't already have it set to NOT look for a satelite dish that you'll need to borrow a direct TV card or else you can't set up the ATSC section.

Also the SIR-360 ins't as sensitive a tuner as the newer ones.

I bought a PHD205, it also has RGBHV out 480p, 720p and 1080i, switch selectable.

You may need and extron box or something similar to make it work with your Barco depending on wheter or not your Barco needs negative sync.

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

when you say it is not as sensitive, what do you mean? Can a good antenna make up the difference?
And can you direct me to any material on this negative sync issue? I would like to know what issues my unit might have. I have never had any trouble with it so far, but that might just be dumb luck. I keep hearing how fussy barcos can be but don't really understand what "fussy" means.

ecrabb · Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 7:02 pm Post subject:

The newer generations of ATSC receivers are much more sensitive, meaning they can find a usable digital signal with much lower signal strength than the older generations of receiver. If you live in a "fringy" area, or are using an indoor or small tabletop antenna, you may want a newer receiver to insure you don't have problems with dropouts and freezes or macroblocking. If, on the other hand, you're close to the transmitters (say 10-15 miles), or you have a good higher-gain outdoor and/or amplified antenna, you may be just fine with an older generation of ATSC receiver.

I've had several older receivers and a few new receivers, and I can say from personal experience there's quite a difference. If you have a smaller indoor or non-amplified antenna, an older receiver like a DTC100 or my old MyHD card may not see the signal at all, while a newer receiver will not only see it and display it, but do so reliably and without issue. Something like a Samsung TS360 is probably somewhere between the oldest receivers and the newest generation.

I'll let somebody else chime in on the Barco because I don't know squat about Barcos. Wink

SC

bbfarmht · Posted: Thu Mar 12, 2009 7:11 pm Post subject:

I've run a RCA ATSC11 it has a dvi for the digital connection I used a dvi-to-hd15 connector commonly found with older video cards. That worked just fine. I did have a slight problem with getting a good signal, but I do live 40 miles from the tv stations. Now I am using a newer antenna and I don't have any problem with reception.

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

well, i live in the middle of the city. but i see the reception issues with several channels on the cheap government subsidized Apex converter we have but it is hooked up to an equally cheap set of rabbit ears. It seems like an amplified antenna would be a bit cheaper than a new fangled top of the line ATSC tuner. what do you think ecrabb?

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:00 am Post subject:

A quality antenna will make a difference for sure. Even on your Apex boxes. However you may be experiancing multipath or even signal over load.

Sometimes when you add an amp to these digital boxes the signal disapears all together. The first time I tired it I thought I had a bad amp. I tested it on the analog chanels and, of course, they worked just fine. No way could I use that amp on the ATSC channels though. If you buy an amplified antenna make sure you can return it.

I've tested a few and the best amplified one I have found so far is a Phillips
http://www.amazon.com/Philips-Performance-Amplified-Indoor-Antenna/dp/B000ES8EG0/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1236919987&sr=1-3

I got mine for $13 at the local discount store. Good antenna.

I also tried the philips PHDTV3 : http://www.amazon.com/Philips-PHDTV3-Indoor-Amplified-Antenna/dp/B000B58VNM/ref=sr_1_7?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1236920095&sr=1-7

It was utterly useless. No channels at all on digital! It ROCKED the analog though. I pulled in abouth 16 channels on my 1977 10" color TV with that and the same on my mother 32" Sony Vega. But again, NONE on the ATSC. I was using it with the Zenith DTT901 Digital TV Tuner Converter Box.

SO antenna's are hit and miss. My best antenna I have is an ATi knock off of the silver sensor ( which BTW is what's inside the PHDTV3! ) the ATi has no amp, I have it mounted on a lamp stand and it is yet to be dethroned as my best NON-amplified antenna.

Here's a picture of it:

Tom.W · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 6635

Where can you find the above antenna and how big is it ?

My sister could use one as she is in a fringe area using rabbit ears...

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:25 am Post subject:

~~I'll go measure it. BRB~~ Wink

16" long, 13" wide at the rear elements.

I'm about 60 miles line of site to the Buffalo stations ( Grand Island NY ) as the crow flies.

I'm about 10 miles from the Canadian stations (CN Tower ) as the crow flies.

I have the antenna 60 feet up off the ground and the nearest building in my way is about 3/4's of a mile.

Terk also makes a version of this antenna though theirs is a little phancier with 2 VHF arials too.

http://www.amazon.com/Terk-Technology-HDTVi-Indoor-Antenna/dp/B0001FV36E

here's a link to a discussion about it Wink

http://www.digitalhome.ca/forum/showthread.php?t=40741&page=3

Oh yeah, I mounted it on that lamp stand it's not included when you but your antenna. It came with a table top stand that tended to tip over.

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

Looks like a little YAGI type antenna. Do you have to swivel it around to hit different transmitters? Great info thanks! I take it from your response you would agree that a good antenna is cheaper than a fancy new tuner, eh?

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

Hey Analog,
check this one out:

http://www.amazon.com/Antennas-Direct-DB2-Directional-Antenna/dp/B000EHUE7I/ref=pd_cp_e_1?pf_rd_p=413863501&pf_rd_s=center-41&pf_rd_t=201&pf_rd_i=B000EHYG9K&pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_r=1X783W9VSDVG7ATY8B6M

They make a couple pricier ones as well with multiple bays. I saw this while looking at the philips you recommended. it just caught my eye because it said "HDTV Antenna" whatever that means!

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:44 pm Post subject:

**AnalogRocks** · Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 4:53 pm Post subject:

MikeEby · Joined: 24 Jun 2007 Posts: 5237 Location: Osceola, Indiana

Yep, outdoors is the only way to go to get a rock solid signal. BTW, Analog....that setup does not have a high of WAF. Smile

Mike

bbfarmht · Posted: Fri Mar 13, 2009 5:10 pm Post subject:

This is the antenna that I bought. Currently I have it mounted indoors. I plan on mounting it in the attic, but I am going to test it up there first! Like I said before I get great reception with that antenna and it only cost $35usd. [/code]

Kiev Savoie · Joined: 25 Oct 2007 Posts: 432

I came across a comparison review of the DB2 vs. the terk HDTVa. here is what he had to say:

Comparison of AntennasDirectDB2 with TerkHDTVa, September 9, 2008
Summary: the Antennas Direct model worked noticeably better than the Terk model. Plus, the fact that the Terk model needs to be plugged in to an electric outlet and you'll probably leave it on 24/7, burning up electricity, makes the Antennas Direct DB2 the better buy by far.

Living in Rockland County, N.Y., about 50 miles from New York, the signals are weak enough that a good antenna is required to get digital signals. I bought the two best-ranked on Amazon, hooked them up to a DigitalStream converter box (of the 3 boxes I have, I like DigitalStream best for its remote which will learn your TV's power on/off signal, and also has its own volume control). I carefully adjusted each antenna for maximum reception (takes time because signal strength fluctuates.)

The results of my mini-experiment: the Antennas Direct DB2 performed better than the Terk HDTVa. This, both from looking at "signal strength" readings, as well as a judgement made after living for about 2 weeks with it set up each way -- the Antennas Direct DB2 was the definite winner.

As to the negatives of the two items:

The Terk HDTVa requires you to plug it in to an electric outlet, and basically keep it plugged in. This means it is plugged in 24/7 and using electricity all the while. Who knows how much that'll cost in electric bills, wasted electricity, etc!

The Postive and Negative of the Antennas Direct DB2 model, is that it really is designed to be hung on a wall -- but if you really want to maximize reception, you must aim it carefully, through a trial-and-error process (same as the Terk, which you must aim). So, the final position that is best for you, might not end up being parallel to a wall! So in the end you'll have to stand this thing up on a flat surface anyway.

Note that the Terk and the Antennas Direct are both roughly the same size... not counting the Terk's two huge rabbit ears you can extend up to 4 feet (which I certainly extended and played with, in making the comparison.)

Also note, that the coaxial cable you use to connect to the Antennas Direct, should be the sort that has a little screw/nut at the end. The cheaper kind, that just slips on and off, might not stay well enough. So I had to go out and buy a $5 coaxial cable segment.

In summary: the Antennas Direct beat the Terk for performance, as well as the fact that it doesn't need to be plugged in and using electricity 24/7.
So this guy seems to prefer it even indoors. The forum discussion you posted definately emphasized the fact that outdoor antennas are better. But I think i'm starting to geek out a little too much here. anything will be a marked improvement over an old pair of rabbit ears. I suppose if i got ambitious i could try to pickup some of the baton rouge stations 50 miles away, but I have enough projects right now. Maybe after my rear projection setup is finished I can play with a high gain outdoor antenna.

MikeEby · Joined: 24 Jun 2007 Posts: 5237 Location: Osceola, Indiana

Found an interesting site about the antenna I have on my roof. The mighty 7 foot diameter Channel Master 4251.

http://www.rocketroberts.com/cm4251/cm4251.htm

It been on my roof almost 10 years, Its big.. On my locals I get 100% signal.

Mike