CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

kschmit2 · Posted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:22 am Post subject:

JohnHWman · Posted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 7:58 am Post subject:

RogueChili · Joined: 31 Mar 2008 Posts: 162 Location: Westfield, MA

I suspected that to be the case, however the MG focus outputs troubled me. Somehow I had the idea the output to the focus would be a function of the horizontal / vertical deflection values.

So, here is the basic concept to duplicate the controller chip.

*Design, document, and build a smart extender card to monitor all the signal lines on the controller chip to create a time stamped data log to be sent to a pc (see attached).

*Design and document software to analyze the data to determine the address decoding and functionality of the controller chip.

*Select a new programmable chip / chips capable of the determined functionality.

*Design, document and build an interface board to mount the new chip / chips.

*Install and debug

wallace123456 · Joined: 14 Aug 2006 Posts: 2236 Location: Northwest VA area

Well, I thought I would give this subject a shot. I exchanged a few emails with Sony, and received the following attached bulletin. But I ain't done yet. Working some other angles. Cool

Email read:

Hi Don,
Unfortunately the IC is No Longer Available and per Procurement there is not an alternate part. See attached tech bulletin
Thank you,
xxxxxxxxxxx

kschmit2 · Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 10:39 am Post subject:

that's the bulletin we've had in the tech section for about 2 years now.

Btw, Sony was still listing the G90 in their Business section in 2007. Price was $38,000

So, they were selling a product they could no longer service at that time.

Tom.W · Joined: 09 Mar 2006 Posts: 6635

Brings new meaning to the phrase " No user serviceable parts "

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Well I just got a copy of the datasheet from Sony but I'm not sure it has the info we are looking for. Its not like a regular datasheet as it was for internal use only and doesn't appear to have specifics. Much of it is in Japanese so I'm still translating. I forwarded a copy of it to John to look at so we will let you know what we find. I guess its a start but I'm not thrilled yet.

emdawgz1 · Joined: 14 Mar 2006 Posts: 7949

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

John responded as I pretty much thought, the document is not much help. It lacks the important information.

JohnHWman · Posted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:10 pm Post subject:

Yeah, it's a one step in the right direction indeed but too small for our need, unfortunately...

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Here's the document. I didnt bother translating because it didnt appear to have relevant info.. But if the whole thing is translated we maybe can pick pieces out of it for more info. I already tried googleing the designer but didnt find much. At least you guys can have some fun with it.

HaydnG90 · Joined: 22 May 2006 Posts: 1356

What's missing from the data sheet? To the uneducated eye it looks pretty comprehensive. But then I'm just a chemist.....

Is there a chance that one of your contacts could find the original vendor for the chips?

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

There is really a lot of information missing from that datasheet about the function of the chip.

I have a contact at Sony who is still trying to find out info on this chip. The email to Japan was responded to but had no encouragement.

The data sheet does give us some info though. We now know who the designer is. Its also possible that the company who designed and built the chip is LSI logic. The question is, does the LSI on the data sheet stand for LSI logic or is it the abbreviation for Large Scale Integration which means it contains 3,000 to 100,000 transistors on 1 chip. Or another company with the abb. containing LSI. Maybe if more of that section of the data sheet can be translated, the company could be found.

The thing is, I'm getting tired of being on the phone for hours or emailing back and forth with very little info from Sony. Unless something substantial comes up soon I'm going to call it quits.

One thing for sure is I will be avoiding Sony products more often after this.

stefuel · Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 12:42 am Post subject:

It sounds as if you guys are asking the right people but perhaps the wrong question. If you ask them who they sourced the chips out to you might get somewhere. Some chip manufacturer someplace has that in their database.

How many G-90's were produced???

wallace123456 · Joined: 14 Aug 2006 Posts: 2236 Location: Northwest VA area

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

That is funny Don. When I was talking to the person today who sent me the PDF I posted, he said someone else had asked for that same data sheet today. My first thought was it had to be someone from here. I figured I would find out who.

Chip, that is among the questions I have been asking. The problem is finding the people who have clue. Thats the hard part. I have found that these chips were made at assy plant E. Problem is no one knows where the f*ck E is......... Confused

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Whats even more discouraging is the service bulletin on the YA board indicating that a new YA board from Sony does not have these chips on it. What I take on that is Sony ran out of those chips before their replacement YA boards were assembled. So why didn't Sony just have more chips made? They know who their supplier is. They would know if there was some lost stock somewhere. Well maybe not lost stock but why not just have some more made. I dont know............this whole thing just seems rediculious.

Mr. Green · Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:22 am Post subject:

Being completely ignorant here, but if the new boards don't have the chips on them, would that indicate that something else replaced it? Could you just need the new YA board?

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Mr. Green · Posted: Fri Feb 06, 2009 1:51 am Post subject:

Oh, that's not good. Sad

I don't have a Sony, but I really like this hobby and would like to keep it alive. A G90 is a goal many want to reach so it's worth saving.

Hopefully my imagination minus the inexperience might come up with a crazy idea that will work. If the chip is lost and it's really important surely there must be a "work around" to keep the sets running.

Having said that... here are another few of ignorant ideas in the form of questions:

1). Is there a Sony projector like the 12XX series (or any projector) that has a board that could take over the needed controls? It would take someone who REALLY knows electronics to hook it up and bypass the chip, but I'm just curious if there's an older more plentiful projector board that could be modified to take over.

2). Not as useful, but could you make a basic board with little trimpots to control the same thing and buy a new existing programable chip to take over the remaining functions?

3). Probably the least favorite idea yet, but could a chip maker be found that could take the info you have plus a few chips and replicate the chip? If you wanted a batch of say 1,000 (depending on what the minimum run would be). It might be worth looking into. Of course, who'd give up a chip for study...?

4). Could a HTPC with a home made program be used to take over the function?

5). Am I helping or hindering? You guys seem to have stalled or are waiting for e-mails from Japan, so I'm trying to keep ideas coming. Thumbs Up

Cheers,
Chris