CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[Mr. Green]

I'm excited about this. Obviously the quality of image isn't remotely up to snuff, but think 3-5 years from now...

http://www.electronista.com/articles/08/06/19/samsung.p400.projector/

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpPlAXBqojU

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pt1_4Hr_-FA&feature=related


I should be able to skip a bulb projector entirely if they bring out some home theatre versions that will do 1080p.

[stuffandpuff]

LED projectors are already five-seven times as bright as models that came out 18 months ago thanks to PhlatLight technology. I think we COULD see LED on par with current LCD in under two years. In fact LED should really outperform LCD and DLP in terms of Contrast and colors and of course lamp/LED life BUT business and technology make strange bed fellows and the better product does not always make it to market. If it did we would all be driving cars that get 500 miles per gallon of gas or better yet, vehicles that require no gas or electricity.

[WanMan]

I'm not looking for something brighter--I'm not a dimwit. I have very good low-light eye performance. I need contract ratio, both in ANSI and On/Off. I have no need for 'trickery' in CR department (a la dynamic CR).

[garyfritz]

Yeah, I've never seen a dynamic CR (iris or otherwise) that I could tolerate. I think they all suck. Give me a display technology that doesn't need hacks like that. LED projectors should do that very nicely.

[ecrabb]

Yep. Dynamic iris (brightness modulation) is a bailing-wire-and-duct-tape solution to the problem of constant-brightness light source and their elevated black levels. Of course, to be fair, it actually does work - sorta.

However, you could say the same of a modulated LED light source like PhlatLight. In the end, it's going to look similar to dynamic iris. It's still going to modulate brightness down on low APL scenes and up on high APL scenes. On the "starry night" scene, the stars are not going to be very bright, while the sunny snowy scene will be. It will be instantaneous, though (unlike the iris) and does eliminate the hot, expensive, inconsistent lamp - which is a good thing. But, there's still a bit of a "hack" feel to it.

Personally, I hope a technology like the LCD LED back lights (with local dimming) comes along for projection. If somebody can do that, you'd have the best of both worlds. Black blacks along with bright whites in low-APL scenes like space, night lights, headlights at night, concerts, etc.

SC

[Person99]

[Person99]

[garyfritz]

In scenes like: star field with planet, camera pans, sun comes into view, planet suddenly gets much dimmer (much dimmer than it should have been due to your eye's irises shutting down) ... I don't see how a DI can do that without visible and annoying artifacts. That's an extreme case but it is not the only place where (in my experience) a DI looks like crap. Dave, how could that case be "well executed" ?

[Person99]

[WanMan]

[WanMan]

[Person99]

[cmjohnson]

I've now seen VDC's new single chip, 1080P, LED-illuminated DLP projector in person. I would not hesitate to say that it is a very good
projector that would be quite at home in almost anybody's home theater. it does not dazzle you with thousands of lumens of light output
but it is sufficiently bright, for certain. Its color gamut is huge and there are no visible rainbow effects due to the very high sequential
color switching rate that VDC has chosen to use. I'm sensitive to rainbow effects and could only get a hint of rainbows when looking
toward the PJ and scanning my eyes rapidly across it. I never saw a rainbow effect on the screen even when TRYING to reveal one,
which is generally easy for me to do on regular single chip or LCD machines.


I'm not about to ditch my 9501LC. Though the new DLP unit is very good, it's not equal to the CRT projector in some ways that
are important to me. And, until such time as it's TRULY better in every way that matters to me, AND I can afford it, I will not
be looking to upgrade while my existing unit is reliable and continues to be in great shape as it is now, with virtually new CRTs with
under 400 hours on them.

CJ



CJ

[Spanky Ham]

CJ,
That is cool. I should stop in on my next trip down to Miami and see this in action.

Scott said in the "Say it aint so" thread that the colors are really good on this pj. I know Alan over at AVS said the same thing, but I take his opinion with a grain of salt. It looks like you saw the same thing. I know from my experience the LEDs did look to impart a different look with what seemed like better colors. Anyway, did you grab one so you can experiment on it?

[cmjohnson]

I wish!

The red is every bit as much of an improvement in the depth and purity of red as it is when you add a color corrected C element to a 9500 that didn't have one.

The green...same deal.

Blue...as good as ever. CRT blue is really just about perfect anyway.


The mix colors (yellow, cyan, magenta) coming out of that unit look a little "off" because their color points are noticeably shifted.

But, since the PJ's color gamut is WIDER than that of the source media, it can be color corrected with a software correction map
to be dead on the original targets. You can't push a PJ to display colors OUT of its own native gamut, but you sure can rein one in
when its gamut is wider than the source.

I would say that if you used an LED-based projector like this, you would want to set it up in such a way that you can select the correct
color map for any given source. Running uncorrected full gamut colors with source material that was recorded in a narrower (legacy)
gamut will give slightly unnatural results.


CJ

[aarenlainey]

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[WanMan]

[WanMan]

[cmjohnson]

FrontAnd's products are not suitable for integration into projectors based on my quick review of their site.

They make LED lamps for automotive uses and for in-home lighting. Nothing that even comes close to competing with
Luminus Devices' Phlatlights or the high power modules from Lighting Sciences Corporation or other industry "luminaries"
such as Cree and Philips LumiLed and Luxeon brands.


I'd say our "guest" qualifies as a commercial spammer.

Incidentally, I'm working on developing some drop-in LED replacements for large venue DLP projectors. It'll require that the
lamp power supplies get modded or replaced as that 40KV start-up spike is probably bad for the LED module and the power delivery
is excessive anyway. I can get 7000 lumens out of 65 watts with LEDs, more than the 6000 lumens out of a 1200 watt UHP lamp.

I think this could be a nice niche market. Lifetime lamp replacement modules, lower power consumption, and maybe even greater
output than the original lamp.

I'm sure I'm not the only one toying with the idea.

CJ


CJ

[Sparky015]

So how long do you think until the LED Pjs will be at a decent price ( ~$5K or less). 5-10 years? CJ, like you, I just put a lot of money and effort upgrading my 8500 to be a 9500LC. I'm hoping it will last me a number of years in the future. When the tubes are shot, I'm planning on changing technology, assuming someone doesn't have a blowout tube sale again.