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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 3:27 am Post subject: cheapest way to boost gamma |
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What is the cheapest/ most bang for the buck way to boost/ control gamma in a DVI-D source to a PJ
The PJ has a eisemann DVI port 3 card. is there anyway to adjust on the card>?
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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Nope. No way to do it on the card as it's not a feature of the card.
Since you've got a direct digital link all the way to the card, the only way to do it is in the digital domain with a video processor (expensive unfortunately).
If it was analog you could use something like the GammaX or Kim's upcoming BUF2000. Both very inexpensive (under $100).
Unfortunately the least expensive route will have you likely replacing the Port 3 DVI board with either an HDfury2 Advanced Kit (which includes the GammaX) or Moome's EXT-FULLHD (which has gamma boost adjustment built in).
Another option would be HTPC or another source that has gamma adjustment built in, but that's not cheap either.
I've owned a few Barco's now and they (like all other CRT projectors) definitely need some gamma boost to get proper gamma tracking.
How do you know it's wrong? You measure it. Here's my CRT projector WITHOUT a gamma boost added:
The yellow line is what the projector is doing, the white line is what I *should* be doing. This is a Barco Cine 8 Onyx CRT projector. You adjust the gamma boost until the yellow line is raised to match up with the white. Simple.
How to do this yourself is covered in my Greyscale & Colour Calibration for Dummies Guide.
Kal
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Angus_rg
Joined: 16 Dec 2007
Posts: 339
Location: A planet far, far away..... Baltimore, MD
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 3:50 pm Post subject: Re: cheapest way to boost gamma |
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| barcoguy wrote: | What is the cheapest/ most bang for the buck way to boost/ control gamma in a DVI-D source to a PJ
The PJ has a eisemann DVI port 3 card. is there anyway to adjust on the card>? |
What are you gamma boosting? If it's a HTPC, use powerstrip or software supplied by your video card. I have an 8800GT, and I felt Powerstrip was better than NVidia's software(probably used the same functions to do it), but that's probably a matter of opinion.
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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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The image is so dark you can only see about 1/2 of the movie. If I used port 5 the RGBHV it looks fine.
I do have an HTPC I will get powerstrip. Will that boost the gamma?
The problem is the HDMI to DVI from the cable box it looks very dark.
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JustGreg
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3098
Location: Kenosha, WI
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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| barcoguy wrote: | The image is so dark you can only see about 1/2 of the movie. If I used port 5 the RGBHV it looks fine.
I do have an HTPC I will get powerstrip. Will that boost the gamma?
The problem is the HDMI to DVI from the cable box it looks very dark. |
I'm not convinced (nor anywhere near as well versed as Kal) your STB can be 'cleaned up'. You can't make a purse out of sows ear my grandfather used to say.(How he knew so much about purses....I don't want to know) 
I don't think the cable box is providing the necessary information to enhance shadow detail regardless of how you process the stream. Without technical specs for the box I don't think anybody here can do anything but speculate. There's alot going on between the sat dish at your cable provider and your house.
I'm also not convinced a processor would get you where you want to be. Ask if they have another box you can compare for shits and giggles. I've been promised a 'new and improved' digital STB for two years now but so far it's Time Warner vapor.
I of course defer to and look forward to being corrected by the pro's. 
Curious now....Is there such a thing as an HTPC graphics adapter HDMI/DVI In/Out that could be used as a processor with Powerstrip?
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Greg
"Is it ignorance or apathy? Hey, I don't know and I don't care!" --Jimmy Buffett
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 7:48 pm Post subject: |
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| barcoguy wrote: | | I do have an HTPC I will get powerstrip. Will that boost the gamma? |
No, the video card drivers have adjustable gamma boost
| Quote: | | The problem is the HDMI to DVI from the cable box it looks very dark. |
The HTPC can't help you with that as it's a different source.
You mentioned that your pictures so dark that you can only see 1/2 the image. I'm not sure what the means exactly, but that doesn't sound right. Your projector's likely not set up correctly (G2 incorrect) and/or the contrast/brightness in the projector are wrong.
Kal
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26706
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 7:53 pm Post subject: |
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| JustGreg wrote: | | barcoguy wrote: | The image is so dark you can only see about 1/2 of the movie. If I used port 5 the RGBHV it looks fine.
I do have an HTPC I will get powerstrip. Will that boost the gamma?
The problem is the HDMI to DVI from the cable box it looks very dark. |
I'm not convinced (nor anywhere near as well versed as Kal) your STB can be 'cleaned up'. You can't make a purse out of sows ear my grandfather used to say.(How he knew so much about purses....I don't want to know)
I don't think the cable box is providing the necessary information to enhance shadow detail regardless of how you process the stream. Without technical specs for the box I don't think anybody here can do anything but speculate. There's allot going on between the sat dish at your cable provider and your house.
I'm also not convinced a processor would get you where you want to be. Ask if they have another box you can compare for shits and giggles. I've been promised a 'new and improved' digital STB for two years now but so far it's Time Warner vapor.
I of course defer to and look forward to being corrected by the pro's.
Curious now....Is there such a thing as an HTPC graphics adapter HDMI/DVI In/Out that could be used as a processor with Powerstrip? |
By the time you do that and argue with it. As we all have had to do with a HTPC. You might as well buy a proper processor.
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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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| kal wrote: | | barcoguy wrote: | | I do have an HTPC I will get powerstrip. Will that boost the gamma? |
No, the video card drivers have adjustable gamma boost
| Quote: | | The problem is the HDMI to DVI from the cable box it looks very dark. |
The HTPC can't help you with that as it's a different source.
You mentioned that your pictures so dark that you can only see 1/2 the image. I'm not sure what the means exactly, but that doesn't sound right. Your projector's likely not set up correctly (G2 incorrect) and/or the contrast/brightness in the projector are wrong.
Kal |
AWESOME I think its an ATI 9600 I tried to run it with UBUNTU but found the video drivers to be a pain. Looks like its back to windoh xp
G2 is good adjusted until the 3 green driver lights go out. I have an BG808 with some eisemann mods + HD144s
1/2 the image I was trying to say anything with a shadow or not in full light just shows up as black or almost black.
It only happens though the eisemann DVI modded port 3 card.
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sat Nov 15, 2008 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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"Cheapest way to boost gamma" on a Barco is to light a fire under it's ass and run like heck.
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Chip
A Barco is only a AmPro with training wheels
Card carrying member of the AVS chain gang.
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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 12:04 am Post subject: |
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LOL SO BASICALLY! what you are saying is there is no good way to do this. I assume a weakness of barco?
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 12:30 am Post subject: |
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I shouldn't be so hard on you but DAMN if it don't seem to smoke Pete out. You may not be aware of our little internet fencing match. I like to let Pete think he's winning with a few pokes and jabs then I pull the protective tip off and thrust one right through the heart 
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Chip
A Barco is only a AmPro with training wheels
Card carrying member of the AVS chain gang.
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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| Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 1:10 am Post subject: |
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| barcoguy wrote: | 1/2 the image I was trying to say anything with a shadow or not in full light just shows up as black or almost black.
It only happens though the eisemann DVI modded port 3 card. |
I think you need to talk to Greg then. You shouldn't be losing 1/2 the information, especially giving the price of his mods.
| barcoguy wrote: | | LOL SO BASICALLY! what you are saying is there is no good way to do this. I assume a weakness of barco? |
No! Not at all. I've seen and owned all sorts of different brands of CRT projectors including a many Barco models and by far, Barco is one of the best at bringing out low-light/shadow detail. Something does not sound right with your setup: Either with the DVI mod'ed port 3 board, the setup, or the projector.
If you say that it doesn't happen with the regular 5BNC input (port 5) but does happen with Greg's mod'ed port 3 board then you need to either talk to Greg to get it fixed or replace it with an HDfury2 or EXT-FULLHD into port 5.
What Barco projector do you have?
Kal
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VideoGrabber
Joined: 09 Apr 2006
Posts: 933
Location: Michigan
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| Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 1:24 am Post subject: |
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BarcoGuy,
> LOL SO BASICALLY! what you are saying is there is no good way to do this. I assume a weakness of barco? <
I have to reinforce Kal's comment. Chip was just poking fun here. Don't take him seriously. What you're experiencing is not a Barco weakness.
> If I used port 5 the RGBHV it looks fine. <
Logic should then tell you that the Barco itself isn't to blame, and the problem is exclusively with the Port3 mods. From almost everyone who's posted, Greg apparently does a good job at taking care of his customers, so I'd get in touch and let him know about your issues. Certainly give him a chance to rectify the problem.
Kal,
he's got an 808G. With Eisemann mods, and HD144 lenses. Should be excellent, by the specs.
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kal
Forum Administrator
Joined: 06 Mar 2006
Posts: 18114
Location: Ottawa, Canada
TV/Projector: JVC DLA-NZ7
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stefuel
Joined: 07 Mar 2006
Posts: 3353
Location: Green Harbor MA USA
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| Posted: Sun Nov 16, 2008 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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"Chip was just poking fun here. Don't take him seriously. "
I actually like Barco's. Just don't let Pete know.
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Chip
A Barco is only a AmPro with training wheels
Card carrying member of the AVS chain gang.
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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 2:45 am Post subject: |
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Its ok you guys make this stuff fun! Yea the mods I found used a while back. soo I will contact him and see what he says. The neckboard mods made a difference.... The switcher card I think made very little difference. But the HD144 lens made a HUGE difference!! The icing on the cake was the port 3 mod card I have the DVI wire coming out of the side of the projector. It made the biggest difference but its so dark its very hard to tell.
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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:00 am Post subject: |
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I also have a convergence on green card! The 808G with all these mods really made a night and day difference over stock. I would recommend anyone to get into an 808. It's not a line of BS. The average viewer said WOW! Is this a new projector? What did you do to it? Followed by leave it alone don't change anything else.
1. one of the cheapest to find used w/ good tubes
2. GET the joust mod its worth it
3. GET convergence on green you need it
4. GET Board mods done. MUST HAVE PORT 3 mod it makes a NIGHT & DAY difference
Don't want to start a flame war but has anyone done a heads up blind comparison between Mike Parker mods and Greg Eisemann?
I would love to hear the results or I would be willing to shoot screen shots and post.
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Mark_A_W
Joined: 15 Mar 2006
Posts: 3068
Location: Sunny Melbourne Australia
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 3:31 am Post subject: |
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Given the price/effort of all these mods, surely it would make sense to start with a LC projector?
LC makes such a huge difference.
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barcoguy
Joined: 05 Feb 2008
Posts: 128
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| Posted: Mon Nov 17, 2008 4:05 am Post subject: |
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True LC is better. I guess considering the current market an LC unit can be had for very little. I got the 808 in 2003 for $800 with a set of NIB tubes. It was a deal of a life time back then. Now thats a different story.
Does anyone know of a power strip type program for a mac?
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Person99
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 4899
Location: Flower Mound, TX
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| Posted: Tue Nov 18, 2008 6:34 pm Post subject: |
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It does sound like the card needs to go back to greg. If you are sending it back to greg you might ask him for the cost of a modification. Basically, greg's DVI input solution is a chip solutions ouputting directly into a modified port 3 board. I.E. the DAC chip's RGBHV output are routed into the board instead of the board getting them from the DB9 connector. Since there is a link between the chip and the board that is analog, it would be quite easy to put the "guts" of a GammaX in there. YOu could ask greg how much he would charge to do that (if he would do it) when you ask about getting your board fixed. Just tell him you'll send him a GammaX with the board. Just a thought.
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