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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 5:25 am Post subject: Trouble with a Barco Data 808S ( three main issues) |
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Running RGBHV direct from a standard DVD player with RGB out. The issues are as follows.
1. Image has interfering vertical lines that scale up the image. They vary in height from a few inches to maybe a foot. Imagine a one foot high or thick line, of a slightly different shade than the rest of the image moving through (up) the image. It's not a single line but a few lines of various sizes. The lines are present 80% of the time. They do not appear when the image is static. I don't mean static as when you hit pause. I mean, for example, during the Copyright warning or the menu on a DVD, the lines are not visible. It only seems to happen when a movie plays.
2. Brightess issue.
The image brightens by itself, You can see the raster getting brighter and brighter and than it will get darker and return to normal. This is consistent. It happens every 30 seconds or so. I had this problem with an old ECP many years ago but I forget what caused it and how I fixed it.
3. Focus problem.
I cant get consistent focus around the entire perimeter and top and bottom at the same time. I know this is caused by the angle of the lens in relation to the tube face but I don't see any adjustments to change the angle of the lenses. I'm not referring to toe in) The lenses swing in and out in order to converge. My problem is up and down and side to side focus. The image is focused on the tube face. Electrohome ECPs have three bolts around the lenses to adjustment but I can't find anything to adjust on the Barco.
Also when adjusting electronic focus, the adjustments only seem to work when I'm focusing the center of the image. When I try and focus the R&L and U&D portions, I do not see any change at all. The numbers are changing but it does not seem to effect the focus. This applies to all three tubes.
Anyone want to take a stab? Thanks.
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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jkruger
Joined: 24 Oct 2007
Posts: 2435
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:50 pm Post subject: |
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I thought all the models with the S letter suffix had sheimpflug adjustment.
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WTS
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 1276
Location: Calgary
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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HI,
Did all of these problems seem to appear at the same time? Hopw many hrs on this unit?
One thing to check is if it's happening on all 3 tubes or just one. Turn off all tubes but one at a time and see if all have the same problems.
_________________
Thanks
Walter
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jkruger
Joined: 24 Oct 2007
Posts: 2435
Location: Carlsbad, CA
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| Posted: Thu Oct 16, 2008 2:11 pm Post subject: |
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Are you trying to use component out into RGBHV?
" Running RGBHV direct from a standard DVD player with RGB out."
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:26 am Post subject: |
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Thanks for the suggestions.
I. tried the same DVD player with S-video. No lines in the image. I loaned out my only other VGA breakout cable so I can't try another cable at the moment. I'm going to hook my PC up and see what happens. If I have the same problem I've narrowed it down to either the cable or the RGBHV input. If it's the input, it looks like a pain in the ass to troubleshoot as all inputs are hard soldiered to the same circuit board.
2. I know what you are thinking but it's not G2 related. I'm really hoping it's just a bad breakout cable.
3. Thanks for the PDF, My image size is within the specs which should not require washers to obtain good focus.
Will update.
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:28 am Post subject: |
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| jkruger wrote: | Are you trying to use component out into RGBHV?
" Running RGBHV direct from a standard DVD player with RGB out." |
No. I should have said VGA. The DVD player has VGA. I'm using a breakout cable VGA-RGBHV. Thanks.
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:30 am Post subject: |
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| WTS wrote: | HI,
Did all of these problems seem to appear at the same time? Hopw many hrs on this unit?
One thing to check is if it's happening on all 3 tubes or just one. Turn off all tubes but one at a time and see if all have the same problems. |
Thanks, It's happening on all tubes. The total hours is a little over 5000 but I don't think the tubes have half that many hours as they are in mint condition and sharp as a tack.
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 1:34 am Post subject: |
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| jkruger wrote: | | I thought all the models with the S letter suffix had sheimpflug adjustment. |
I thought all projectors after 1990 had them. Guess not. According to the manual I shouldn't need any adjustment (washers) for my image size.
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timf
Joined: 07 Jul 2007
Posts: 102
Location: Adelaide South Australia
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:11 am Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | According to the manual I shouldn't need any adjustment (washers) for my image size. |
I could be wrong here but I would be surprised if you didnt need them. The washers arent used to create an image size or screen width, they are meant to be installed so you can carry out manual lens flapping and corner focus correctly for the screen width you have, you will notice that the manual has differing washer combinations depending on the screen width minimum and maximum size values stated.
If you are having problems edge focussing then as far as I can tell you need to use the washers
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 4:33 am Post subject: |
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| timf wrote: | | Quote: | | According to the manual I shouldn't need any adjustment (washers) for my image size. |
I could be wrong here but I would be surprised if you didnt need them. The washers arent used to create an image size or screen width, they are meant to be installed so you can carry out manual lens flapping and corner focus correctly for the screen width you have, you will notice that the manual has differing washer combinations depending on the screen width minimum and maximum size values stated.
If you are having problems edge focussing then as far as I can tell you need to use the washers |
Tim,
Let me clarify. It's not edge focus per say, it's top and bottom and side to side.
What I meant when I said I don't need washers for my screen size is that the manual states I only need to install the washers if I am setting it up on a screen under a certain size ( around 70" or over 120" roughly) Since my screen is only 7'wide I should not have to adjust the lenses in relation to the tube face. In other words,according to the manual, I should be able to focus properly on a 7' screen without the need for washers.
As I'm thinking about it, it must be electronic focus that's off. I checked the tube face and it looked in focus but I did'nt really take a good hard look so I have to check again.
The Barco allows you to focus the center top,bottom and both sides independently (electronically) and I think that must be the problem but the issue I am having is that I can clearly see the change in focus (electronically not manually) when I select the center of the screen and adjust the electronic focus but I see no change when I do the same for the top, bottom and sides. I know on my G70 I had to do something to unlock the ability to electronically focus.. The numbers would change but the focus wouldn't until I unlocked the feature. The same type of thing occurs with the Barco, The numbers change but the focus does not (top bottom sides)
Does anyone know if I have to do something special in order to have control over electronic focus for the entire screen?
--------------------------
UPDATE:
Tim,
I wrongly assumed that there were no washers installed to begin with. That was incorrect. I understood the manual incorrectly. The washers are there but only need to be changed if you go bigger or smaller than what the manual specifies. The washers on my Barco were installed in a way which does not correspond with any of the examples given in the manual so I think I found my focusing problem.
Thanks.
Last edited by stuffandpuff on Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:12 pm; edited 1 time in total
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 4:49 am Post subject: |
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UPDATE:
Problem number 1 and 2 solved.
It was my crappy DVD player. Since it has VGA out, I decided to plug it into my PC monitor. Same problem, lines running through the picture and brightness that swells up and down. Actually the thought to try the DVD player with my monitor came about two hours after I had already dragged my whole PC from upstairs to the basement in order to try it with the Barco to see if it was the breakout cable. Would have been much easier and simpler to bring the DVD player upstairs or so said my wife.... Women! 
For the first hour I got nothing, no picture at all. I could not figure out what the heck was wrong until I remembered I had put the lens caps on in order to protect them.
Thanks for everyone's input! Still need to figure out the focus.
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AnalogRocks
Forum Moderator
Joined: 08 Mar 2006
Posts: 26706
Location: Toronto, Ontario, Canada
TV/Projector: Sony 1252Q, AMPRO 4000G
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 4:54 am Post subject: |
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| stuffandpuff wrote: | UPDATE:
For the first hour I got nothing, no picture at all. I could not figure out what the heck was wrong until I remembered I had put the lens caps on in order to protect them.
. |
 Classic 
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 5:26 am Post subject: |
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| AnalogRocks wrote: | | stuffandpuff wrote: | UPDATE:
For the first hour I got nothing, no picture at all. I could not figure out what the heck was wrong until I remembered I had put the lens caps on in order to protect them.
. |
Classic |
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Ile
Joined: 09 Mar 2006
Posts: 1491
Location: Jyväskylä, Finland
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 6:38 am Post subject: |
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| stuffandpuff wrote: | | What I meant when I said I don't need washers for my screen size is that the manual states I only need to install the washers if I am setting it up on a screen under a certain size ( around 70" or over 120" roughly) Since my screen is only 7'wide I should not have to adjust the lenses in relation to the tube face. In other words,according to the manual, I should be able to focus properly on a 7' screen without the need for washers. |
That is when you buy new projector, it have settings for your screen size. Probably someone have chanced washers for other screen size. Check that you have settings like this. If projector is ceiling mounted turn picture 180 deg. 
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Spotmatic
Joined: 29 Jun 2006
Posts: 531
Location: Gelderland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 12:19 pm Post subject: |
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Reading all this, I'm almost 100% sure that the problem is that the H-phase is not correctly set. An incorrect H-phase causes the image to 'fold over' at the left or right side of the picture, causing all sorts of interference.
Solution: go into the Geometry menu and see what happens when you modify the H-phase.
If this is not the solution then I'll just jump back into my bed, never to come out again
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| Spotmatic wrote: | Reading all this, I'm almost 100% sure that the problem is that the H-phase is not correctly set. An incorrect H-phase causes the image to 'fold over' at the left or right side of the picture, causing all sorts of interference.
Solution: go into the Geometry menu and see what happens when you modify the H-phase.
If this is not the solution then I'll just jump back into my bed, never to come out again |
Go back to bed, It' definitely not the Horizontal phase.! but thanks!
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 10:03 pm Post subject: |
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| Ile wrote: | | stuffandpuff wrote: | | What I meant when I said I don't need washers for my screen size is that the manual states I only need to install the washers if I am setting it up on a screen under a certain size ( around 70" or over 120" roughly) Since my screen is only 7'wide I should not have to adjust the lenses in relation to the tube face. In other words,according to the manual, I should be able to focus properly on a 7' screen without the need for washers. |
That is when you buy new projector, it have settings for your screen size. Probably someone have chanced washers for other screen size. Check that you have settings like this. If projector is ceiling mounted turn picture 180 deg. |
Ile,
Last night I took a look without removing the lenses and it looked like there were no washers at all but I ended up removing the lenses today and you are correct but the way it was set up with the number and position of the washers does not correspond with any of the examples given and the washers are all black, not black and gray per the manual so I'm not sure if that's going to be an issue. I imagine the different color washers relate to the size/thickness and thus I need to know the exact size/thickness of both the black and gray washers.
I should be fine now but I was thinking about how the mounting position effects the washer placement. Assuming I follow the manual and install the washers for a 7' image with the projector on a table. Wouldn't the position of the washers change in a ceiling mount position? The manual does not make a distinction between table and ceiling mount, with respect to washer placement.
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Cousin.It
Joined: 09 Feb 2007
Posts: 41
Location: Hurst, TX
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| Posted: Fri Oct 17, 2008 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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| stuffandpuff wrote: | | Wouldn't the position of the washers change in a ceiling mount position? |
No, the washers set the geometry between the lenses and the tube faces and that stays fixed. It won't matter what orientation the projector is in as long as the screen size stays the same.
Mark
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stuffandpuff
Joined: 30 Jul 2008
Posts: 69
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| Posted: Sat Oct 18, 2008 12:06 am Post subject: |
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| Cousin.It wrote: | | stuffandpuff wrote: | | Wouldn't the position of the washers change in a ceiling mount position? |
No, the washers set the geometry between the lenses and the tube faces and that stays fixed. It won't matter what orientation the projector is in as long as the screen size stays the same.
Mark |
Thanks Mark,
Makes complete sense when you put it that way. It's a head scratcher when you first think about it. At least for me it was.
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