CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

[XANATOS]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p4ebtj1jR7c

http://www.defensereview.com/article741.html



man if only i could have had a chopper like this back when i was a kid






XANATOS

[draganm]

i've ownded guns before and I thnik they should remain legal to some degree but as i get older i find humanity's obsession with improving the art of killing completely disturbing. i mean those guys were obviously having a lot of fun but ultimately that new gun will be used to shred apart other human beings, not plastic buckets.
Just imagine if all the resources and technology allocated to murder for the last 100 years had been used to solve the worlds energy problems?

[ecrabb]

Let's also just imagine if there were no bad people in the world. We wouldn't even need weapons. Unfortunately, there are bad people, so we do need weapons. "Kill" is not synonymous with "murder", Dragan.

SC

[draganm]

ok, so how long before some disturbed kid turns loose one these weapons on his classmates. Or how long before some Jihadi cuts one loose in rush hour traffic. I bet with a couple of 30 round drums you could wipe out at least 2 dozen people.
The point is by making weapons like this your promoting murder whether you meant for that to happen or not. The people who designed and built this weapon and all others like it are simplyt sub-human. They chose to put their energy into killing as opposed to something else.

[ecrabb]

I see... So because weapons can (and some eventually are) used to murder people, then the people who design said weapons are sub-human. By making the weapon, you're "promoting murder"? "Promoting murder"? Seriously?

By that logic, in manufacturing cars, you're promoting speeding or reckless driving. By manufacturing beer, you're promoting alcoholism. By manufacturing computers, you're promoting hacking. Can you not distinguish the difference between "use" and "misuse"?

Before modern guns, there were muzzle-loaders. Before muzzle-loaders, there were spears, axes, and bow-and-arrow. Before that, there were clubs and rocks. Practically every culture has had weapons that could be used to defend life - or extinguish it - depending on which side of the weapon you're on. I see no difference between this weapon and the plethora of weapons used through the ages, save for perhaps the efficiency with which the killing can be executed.

So, a couple of guys that work in law enforcement... They see where law enforcement personnel are outgunned or at a disadvantage against criminals, so they design a weapon to more easily neutralize said threat. You'd call them subhuman - because it could be misused?!?!?

SC

[greg_mitch]

I'm not a gun guy...but that thing is crazy cool looking.

[garyfritz]

SC, a car is designed to provide transportation. A computer is designed to do many jobs. That shotgun is designed to kill people. (Oh sure, I know you could use it to hunt quail, but that's NOT what it's designed for.)

It's very cool, it's a great design, and I'm sure it's very good at its intended purpose. But there's a big difference between a tool whose intended purpose is to convey you from point A and point B, and a tool whose INTENDED PURPOSE is to efficiently kill people. If it was only used in warfare -- where a soldier's job is often to kill people -- it would be a valuable tool. If it got into the wrong hands, it would be a problem just as a bomb would be a problem.

Yes, I realize it can be used with non-lethal loads for crowd control &etc. But get real, that's not what it's designed for.

I'd say draganm went a bit far (so what else is new?? ) but his basic point is valid: if you build a tool that is intended to kill people, it's pretty hard to say you're not promoting murder. Even if said murder happens in an "approved" context like war.

And yes -- it's still crazy cool looking.

[XANATOS]

gentleman the reason i posted the links was not to
start a debate.I believed the many action movie
junkies myself included , would enjoy seeing some state of the art bang bang . full auto shotguns are nothing
new ,they have been around since before WWII the best
of them being the usas.untill the advent of the
Auto Assault-12 Shotgun.


as for myself buying one when production hits it
stride . well i wont e able to go down to the
gun store but if i want one it will be mine


XANATOS

[unkyjoesa]

Draganm said:

[unkyjoesa]

One more thing:

Draganm said:

[AnalogRocks]

I always like the SPAS -12 for door breaching in Rogue Spear. It's also fun to assign your snipers an auto shotgun LOL..

[AnalogRocks]

I always like the SPAS -12 for door breaching in Rogue Spear. It's also fun to assign your snipers an auto shotgun LOL..

[unkyjoesa]

I prefer a scattergun, filled with rocksalt and other various painful items.

Gets the point across without doing too much damage to the Human Body.

I agree that weapons, firearms whatever can be perverted and used to kill people, but they dont work well without someone on the other end to pull the trigger.

Hell some of us cant even get along in the forums, its called a difference of opinion. WORLD PEACE is a long way away.

Guns can also be used to protect yourself and your loved ones from others without the same high moral standards.

For the record, I beileve the orig intent of a firearm was to pick off prey animals at a distance, causing human culture to flourish as the brain grows on animal protiens, It was Humans that turned it on one another.

Sorry for the rant

[PJMoore]

Nice try at pissing off folks, dragan, but I've got you beat big time. I am a life long liberal Democrat, believe in a woman's right to choose, have a concealed carry permit, shot competitively with fully automatic subguns, and I love my assault rifle. I piss off both sides at the same time! The only thing I murder is a piece of target paper and a lot of people's comfort zone.

[unkyjoesa]

PJMoore,

I do believe you are going straight to hell for that

[PJMoore]

Good chance - fine with me, though - all my friends wil be there with me.

[XANATOS]

i like the spas 12 looks cool works nice ,if it jams you can clear it with the slide ,but for real killing POWER
i liked the mighty Cobray Street Sweeper ,now days i love the SAIGA 12 looks like my ak never jams 10 rounds as fast
as i can pull the triger the cactus on my property lives in fear


XANATOS

[draganm]

you guys are confusing a normal firearm that can be used to defend yourself or your home with a fully automatic slaughter gun. No one here will be buying that thing either unless you sign away your freedom against having your home searched at any time without a warrant (Yes i know people who have owned the automatic weapon liscense). I have also fired a couple of sub-machine guns and yes it was cool 20 years ago but after the repeated salughter we have seen in the last 10 years I see no reason for them in society.
Like I said earlier, I am not in favor of banning guns and I even like the conclealed carry laws. however, anything that is semi-auto and can kill a dozen people without re-loading should be outlawed. Please don't give me any crap about how cars can kill people because the biggest slaughters at our high schools and colleges could not have been acomplished with a car. Also spare me the fanatsy about defending your freedom with a gun, if the Federal government decides to send the army into yuor neighborhood no amount of firearms will stop them. if you don't believe me go and see what happened at Waco TX, or ruby ridge, or to people defending their homes after Katrina. I mean the crazy, ready to die Islamists in Falluja had a lot more than just guns and the Marines crushed them in a few days.

[XANATOS]

DRAQANM

i am not going to give you any $hit,for your point of view,i understand it.
and i am not to give you any bull $hit about guns dont kill people kill people,well people kill
but we use guns to do it,not cars not knives are hammers

but no free man should be willing to give up any of his rights because of street criminals





XANATOS

[bbfarmht]

How's the saying go "we can't do that anymore because of a few bad apples" Many things that we used to be able to do years ago are regulated because of the people who took advantage of the loop hole for their own gain/selfishness.

[perisoft]

So, Draganm, am I subhuman because I designed a motion platform used to train soldiers, who are, by your accounting, murderers?

Please do tell.