CurtPalme.com Home Theater Forum

dropzone7 · Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 1069 Location: Charlotte, NC

I did my "before" readings last night with my new Eye One LT meter. I can already tell that this meter is much more accurate and reliable than the Spyder II which I tried back when the guide was first written. I have a question about something I noted in the "measures" data. There is a line near the top that gives a value for average gamma and contrast ratio. My gamma was at 1.55 and contrast was 316:1. That contrast seems really low. Is that normal? These initial reading are with brightness and contrast set to defaults of 60 and 75, much higher than I normally set them at for viewing. The guide suggested setting levels to default so that is what I did. I'm getting about 13.126 foot lamberts with the sensor placed optimally at the screen.

daveginsd · Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 4

I found this site last night and found the "grayscale for dummies" very helpful. I do have a question regarding my particular RPTV, its a Tosh 56HM195, and it has RGB cuts and drives, however these only effect SD material. It does have RGB center contrast controls that seem to have effect on HD grayscale. Would it be possible to get an explanation of how one would best adjust grayscale with these type of controls? I've searched high and low and have yet to find someone who can describe how these are used. I do very much appreciate all the info I've found on your site.

**kal** · Posted: Mon Aug 11, 2008 3:11 pm Post subject:

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

daveginsd · Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 4

I bought the service manual theres only one menu as far as I can tell, unless there are some hidden ones which I hear tosh does. The cuts and drives most definately only effect SD, and the controlls listed in the service manual as "CNTCG, CNTCR, CNTCB" and the description given is "G CONTRAST CENTER, R CONTRAST CENTER, B CONTRAST CENTER" only effect HD material. The manual really had very little info in it at all most of it I had already found by searching online, kinda bent I spent the money. If any one can shed some light I'd appreciate it.

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Toshiba manuals really do suck. They contain very little info on service menu. In your service manual, on the page of setting and adjustment data, does it have a note at the bottom saying " The image system data xxxxxxxxxxx is different by each image format." ?

daveginsd · Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 4

yes, it says Items marked with * which includes, BRTC, COLC, UVTT, CNTX, which leads to another question what is "base band tint" and how does this differ from regular tint or does it?

macgyver655 · Joined: 22 Aug 2007 Posts: 8508

Baseband tint is an adjustment of the chroma part of the signal. It would give more of a shiney vs dull appearence, rather then an actual tint. You will find a lot of different terms in a bulb style device vs a tube style. You can fiddle with color settings all day in a DLP or LCD RPTV and your still not going to get a real good color balance. Remember, they cant really do black.

But you can make them look better then the factory settings. A problem with Toshiba, besides their poor service manuals is they regularly leave names of adjustments in the service menu, but disable the feature so that the control doesn't work.
This may be why it doesn't seem to change when in HD.

Did you try making adjustments while an HD signal was being inputted? Make sure the tv recognizes the HD signal before entering the service menu.

daveginsd · Joined: 11 Aug 2008 Posts: 4

Tried it out last night, input an HD signal then entered the service mode, no change. How would it benifit a television manufacturer to bypass features in a service menu. On my Mits I had before, it had a laundry list of features, and pretty good descriptions of them as well. Do you think these and other features could be unlocked, or perhaps in another unmentioned menu? I've read on some other sights about a "Designer Menu" in some older Tosh units, that in later units they were hidden better. Possable to find out info on these, if I contact Tosh and complain loud enough?

paiaboy7 · Joined: 15 Aug 2008 Posts: 68

I get the following message when I go to calibrate internal sensor offsets in step 1.10

Eye One .DLL not found. Cannot use EyeOne device/ This DLL can be found in probe software installation directory/ please copy it inside HCFR coloromiter installation directory.

Please Help.

Thanks

dropzone7 · Joined: 12 Jun 2007 Posts: 1069 Location: Charlotte, NC

jwong · Joined: 28 Aug 2008 Posts: 1 Location: Hong Kong

Hi Kal,

Thx for your nice "GREYSCALE & COLOUR CALIBRATION FOR DUMMIES", I have a very basic concept/skill after reading this article. For me, I live in Hong Kong & we can only find Spyder in the market. I'm using Sony KLV-40X300 (equal to BR5 in US). I started calibrate my TV in the past few days (at night actually). I found that my colorimeter cannot detect signal at 0IRE & 20IRE but can detect signal at 10IRE, 30-100IRE if I measure Gray scale (already set at 2000ms). If the colorimeter work find if i make continuous measures (set to 300ms).

1) Is anything wrong for my colorimeter or any setting i have to special take care ?
2) Btw, I found that after i install HCFR, my SpyderTV Software cannot detect the colorimeter. Is it a known bug ?

Please advise, thanks.

I'll try to re-install the HCFR SW tonight.

JWong

damaster · Joined: 12 Sep 2008 Posts: 4

Hi folks,

I'm a long time AVS member who found this guide in the past 6 months and went out and ordered an EyeOne. I've since done the grayscale on 3 RP CRT sets, 1 plasma, and 1 LCD, and I must say this guide is awesome! It is very well written, very thorough and incomparably one of the best calibration guides I've ever come across!

Now I've moved on to color calibration, and unfortunately my Toshiba 50H82 RP CRT doesn't have any CMS controls; not in the user menus and not in the service menus. However, I am using an HTPC for all of my viewing, and was wondering if I could adjust the colors through the ATI video card control panel to achieve a near perfect color calibration. The only problem is I don't understand how to co-relate the video card controls to those described in the guide.

The ATI control panel allows me to control the Gamma, Brightness, and Contrast for each of the primary color channels (RGB). Is the following correlation of these controls to those described in the guide correct?:
Gamma = color 'hue'
Brightness = color 'luminance'
Contrast = color 'saturation'

Thanks in advance.

damaster · Joined: 12 Sep 2008 Posts: 4

**kal** · Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2008 7:55 pm Post subject:

**kal** · Posted: Sat Sep 13, 2008 7:56 pm Post subject:

damaster · Joined: 12 Sep 2008 Posts: 4

bubsnews · Joined: 08 Jun 2008 Posts: 15

I have two questions regarding the guide.

1) Curt says in the guide that you adjust the red primary using the 'color' adjustment and the cyan secondary using the 'tint' control before moving on to the advanced color adjustments in your CMS. He also says that these two controls are not available for high definition inputs. If that is the case, how do I adjust red and cyan before getting into the other steps to advanced color calibrations?

2) I've never been comfortable with setting the initial contrast point. This seems rather arbitrary to me. If your projector provides plenty of lumens, then how do you adjust contrast according to the guide instructions? I mean, is it really just as simple as finding your target ftL reading by adjusting contrast? I would think since this adjustment precedes all other adjustments, that it might be a more scientific adjustment not simply increase or decrease until you reach a range of ftL.

I have a DLP front projector 1080, BenQ W5000.

Thanks for any advice and/or assistance,
George

Curt, love the guide man, keep up the great work! My displays never looked anywhere near as impressive as they have lately after I found your site and bought an EyeOne colorimeter and using your ColorHCFR software. Thanks again!

**kal** · Posted: Wed Sep 17, 2008 1:21 am Post subject:

bubsnews · Joined: 08 Jun 2008 Posts: 15

Sorry about that 'slip' Kal. I know that you wrote it, we've corresponded before.

As far as the question regarding adjustments of red and cyan in the guide...

Step 8.2, Adjusting the Color Control
Guide says check 'Y' value with "100% Gray window", then skip to "100% Red window" and adjust using the color control so that 'Y' is 21% of 100% Gray window 'Y'.

Step 8.3, Adjusting the tint control
Guide says check 'Y' value with "100% Gray window", then skip to "100% Cyan window" and adjust using the tint control so that Cyan 'x' and 'y' values equal 0.225 and 0.329 respectively.

If I'm using HDMI and my color and tint controls are greyed out, how would I adjust red and cyan? All the other primaries and secondaries have x and y coordinates so I know where they are supposed to be. I see now under step 8.3, that there are x and y coordinates for cyan. Still, I can't see how to adjust red if my color control is unavailable.

Again, my apologies for typing Curt instead of Kal TWICE no less, Kal. Thank you for your assistance. Your guide rocks and so do you for putting up with all my questions. I can't thank you enough for how much improvement I see in my displays due solely to your efforts with this guide.

George